https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_tcjOsL-Ak&ab_channel=ChrisWilliamson

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it doesn't take time to make decisions
it takes information to make decisions
and if you have the information to make
the decision then you should make it and
so a lot of people will belabor a
decision when they are not gaining more
information to make it time is not a
requirement of decision making like
information is
worth a hundred million bucks and
sharing a set of headphones together
podcasts bro geez just like middle
school i saw a tweet from you not long
ago that said beginner's overvalue
thinking and undervalued doing advanced
people do the opposite what's that mean
so i think a lot of times um
beginner so the way most people took
that as
is was a uh everybody should be
like advanced people
and execute that's what that's what
people thought i meant by that quote
because i could just see that from the
comments which was not what i meant uh
what i meant by that is in the beginning
most people overthink everything and
they try and find like the perfect path
they try and say like oh this is gonna
be the perfect business model or like i
wanna nail my niche perfectly get my
everything done before they start when

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in reality like all you need to do is
just sell [ __ ] to someone to get going
and so they overvalue
uh the thinking and undervalue the doing
so it's really just productive
procrastination for most people in the
beginning whereas advanced people
they've gotten the habit of doing things
right so they be so what happens is the
doing becomes compulsive so they're just
doing and doing and doing and doing and
they feel like activity is progress
because in the beginning activity was
progress but as it gets bigger and the
amount of work that is required to be
done gets bigger
you need to be more strategic in what
work you're choosing to do
and how you're choosing to make sure
work ensure work gets done um and so the
whole
thing flips where as you're becoming
more advanced it's more about what chess
piece am i going to move rather than
even beginning the game and so that was
kind of the dichotomy or the flip
between uh beginner to advance and i
think there's a lot of those complete
flips that happen in business which is
why the entrepreneurial journey is is a
cool interesting and fun one the way
that i see it a lot of entrepreneurial
journeys are kind of like an hourglass
so you start off at the bottom with a
big wide set of doing things and then

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you narrow in and that's when you don't
have any time to do anything anymore
you're constantly doing everything and
then you widen back out again to be this
person who thinks about everything but
you're right if you're not able to
relinquish control and believe that the
tools that got you here are going to be
the ones that are going to get you there
you're going to start bouncing off the
ceiling of your own capacity no matter
how leveraged you are and your
productivity systems everybody only has
24 hours in the day right
yep 100
do you want to switch to that alex do
you want to go no you're good you're
good
i'm just gonna put this in so it doesn't
doesn't fall out
mine's fine no my ear just just i've
never had like good earphone ears like
that this thing's this is falling out
we're good right so you're using a set
of air pod pro max to hold in
an earbud now i feel great
now i'm ready fantastic you're probably
doing it so he doesn't hear me
that's actually why nice uh what it does
feel more peaceful
what are some of the things that you

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struggled to let go of when it came to
flipping from doing to thinking
it's usually the things that you're best
at you know what i mean um i mean in the
beginning it's obsession that everything
has to be done a certain way where
rather than
certain outcomes need to happen and they
can be done everybody has different
flavors of different styles of working
and you know in the beginning you just
think everything has to be your way
because to be fair everything that was
your way worked because that's where you
are where you are but
realizing that some things can be done
differently and still achieve as good of
a raw and oftentimes better
is something it's a belief that has to
get broken for most entrepreneurs and
then it's easier to break them in
fields that they are not experts in and
then it becomes more difficult to break
it in fields that they are experts in so
it's like easier for me to give up
finance hr
you know maybe even customer support
customer success those are things that i
might not have been as good at but like
product uh marketing and sales might be
things that i feel you know much
stronger and so i'd be more particular
more more likely to want to micromanage
or you know keep control but usually

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it's that control that ends up you
relinquish your freedom when you you
can't have both control and freedom
what about you leila what did you
struggle relinquishing as stuff grew
you know i think i had as hard of a time
with not knowing everything that was
happening in the business because like
in the beginning alex had to let go i
think alex had to let go of more control
in the beginning and i'd actually take
more control in the beginning because by
the nature of how we structure the
businesses it's usually like
i'm going to have most people report to
me and so then at the point where he has
you know me and one other person that
he's talking most time and i have the
eight and i feel like i'm providing
transparency to alex and to
you know anyone else that's asking about
the business and then i have to let go
of that transparency so i think it was
relinquishing control of honestly
being the
internal
i want to say like feeling like the
internal leader almost and so i it gave
me a self of sense of self importance
that
i didn't realize would be that hard to
give up um and so when we decide that
we're going to sell gym launch i
remember the feeling of not leading the

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monthly team meetings and not leaving
the quarterlies and not doing the
leadership training and not doing the
management training and feeling this
like immense
sense of loss and like i realized that i
didn't gain my self-importance from like
being forward-facing like everyone's
like oh don't you want me forward and
face like alex it's like oh i don't need
that i don't need recognition from
others but i didn't realize i was
getting it from the team the whole time
that's where i was getting my sense of
self-importance and from
recognition you're not immune to it
you've just got a different flavor of it
100 so it was like once people started
saying
hey and you know this is a good thing
but i had to train myself to understand
that when they were like maggie kale
dave ed you guys are amazing leaders
this and that and when they started
saying like hey it's actually really
great that you guys are like letting go
and it's been so much better with them
stepping in i'll never forget there was
a phone call where
i sat with one of the leaders and i said
like hey how's it going you know we're
stepping back more you know obviously
we're close towards the end of the sale
like is there anywhere i can support you
anywhere that can add clarity is there
anything that you think i should know
about those are kind of the questions i
asked and he was like layla can i be

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real with you and i was like yeah and he
was like honestly it's like a way better
with you guys out
i was like and it was like knife and
then i was like oh no no this is good
this is good right but like my immediate
like you know human instinct was just
like loss and like you know just feeling
terrible worthlessness worthlessness um
he's like no honestly he's like because
you guys are just so you know intense
and so it's just better we've all been
able to be more creative be more
innovative really like step into our
roles now that you guys aren't so
involved
and hearing that was like
fantastic for where we're at and like
logistically speaking like i was like
this is right on track this is amazing
like it made me super proud of like kale
and maggie and everyone else that
stepped up uh at the same time it was
kind of like the
the
you know the the final knife
where you're like dang like i really did
have a lot of self-importance there and
so for me it was just letting go of that
and letting go of being what i want to
say is like the rock to everybody in the
company like being the person everyone
confided in everyone went to and they
were having a hard time not being that
person anymore was really hard for me

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and just to piggyback on it i think we
like i would say both of us get the same
fulfillment of
being the person that people can bring
complex problems to and be like oh cool
let's let's solve this together they're
just different problems right and so the
thing is is that when you really want
the company to run on its own
you can't be that person right and
that's really hard that's really if
you're just trying to transition out
from ceo to really like owner or
shareholder and you don't necessarily
need to do that but that was the
transition we're trying to make to make
the business sellable and being able to
you know look at someone who's like
really in hell
in in need of help and just saying like
you're gonna have to figure it out
well remember as well it'll make you
guys
feel needed and wanted and a part of the
organization and it's like letting
someone i don't know the you've taught
your son to ride a bike for the last
five years and then finally he goes off
to his first bicycle riding class and
you watch the teacher doing the thing
that you were doing and you're like well
no that was that was my job that was
what i did i i i just want to be needed

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again but i mean ferris has this is it
in the four-hour work week where he
talks about the more that he extracted
himself out of her business the better
that the businesses did
yeah yeah um
alex we're both only children
have you reflected on what impact having
no siblings has had longer term
not really
honestly
i actually have i don't give it any
thought
like it's not a thought that i i give i
also had step siblings from for all of
high school uh so i had like there were
other kind of kids in the house you know
per se we were obviously high schoolers
not you know lower than that so there
was that element but i've never given it
any thought i just find it interesting
i've got some friends that aren't some
friends that aren't i always wonder what
there has to be a difference in
socialization there has to be a degree
of difference you know real formative
years things before you can even
remember them that change and shape the
way that you see the world that you
interact with people maybe you view
social situations in a more

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deconstructed way at least that that's
something i see as a common theme
amongst some of the only children i'm
friends with
i don't know
what about you
how would you say are there any echoes
from sort of your childhood that you see
when it comes to the way that you
operate as an adult certainly for me i'm
i'm always on the outside looking in a
little bit that was kind of a typical
dynamic that i saw when i was a kid and
that's definitely one that i see
reflected now or maybe that's just my
bias maybe that's just the framing
through which i put everything for the
world but uh you know i think i used to
look through that frame a lot more i
don't really anymore i think i kind of
like thought about it enough that just
my brain moved on um but i think you
know i was the youngest uh i had an
older sister and i had a lot of step
siblings and i was still the youngest um
i mean i'm sure that i'm probably more
receptive to
uh authority than alex if i would say
like one difference um like i'm okay
with people being like like
you know i think there's a reason that

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alex is more the visionary and i'm more
of the integrator like i'm that's just
like what i'm good at um it's also what
i enjoy doing a lot um
i would say that you know that really
the things that are more impactful
probably weren't like siblings probably
like being more autonomous in terms of
like how i probably raised myself for
like some of my more formative years
just because the nature of kind of how
my family structure was so i think that
contributed a lot because i have a lot
of self-trust and independence i want to
say um
but that's i mean that's how i would say
it formed me i guess what i would never
say is that i don't think that it is an
excuse for people who are dysfunctional
adults to say well my childhood ex i'm
like well you're a functioning adult now
you can figure out how to do it you know
yeah and if i can piggyback and maybe
give a little bit more color to the
original answer of i haven't thought
about it um
i have difficulty
ascribing reasons to current behaviors
because i think we just don't know why
so it's like i could create 16 different
stories around why i am this way and i

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could probably find people who have
similar character traits to me who were
not only children and so was it the fact
that i was an only child that made me
this way
who knows you know i know i know that i
am this way i know that i behave in
these ways in these conditions and so
they are what they are and i think a lot
of people i'm not saying this good or
bad i'm just saying i have observed that
many people will create stories to
justify the way the reason like well you
know i i never got you know chocolate as
a kid and that's why you chocolate now
i'm like well maybe you just like
chocolate
maybe has nothing to do with the fact
you didn't have this kid maybe if you
had as a kid you'd still eat a lot of
chocolate it has nothing to do with that
right and so people use circumstances to
explain current reality as though it's a
reason for rather than just like
accepting it for what it is which is i
just am this way post-talk
rationalization is a hell of a drug you
can pretty much justify
anything to yourself i've got this
narrative and that's that's one of the
dangerous things right you start to see
some sort of consistent theme in your
life and then everything gets filtered
through that lens and you're like look
it's not a one-size-fits-all thing maybe
there was something maybe there is one

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singular piece of code right that
underwrites everything it's the
bootstrap upon which the entire program
of your life's built
yeah but probably not right probably not
and who knows and and how and how
helpful is it because if we won't if we
if is it important is it knowable you
know to quote charlie and uh warren
is it important probably is it knowable
probably not and so
if it's if it's not importable important
and knowable they just don't focus on it
and so i've always i've tried to use
that to not drive myself insane that's a
really good way for people to let go of
things that they can't find answers to
i mean i mean austin at the moment and
there's a lot of talk of
trauma work and integration and and
healing past selves and and stuff like
that and
coming from the
uh most working-class town in the uk
this is language that i'm not like super
familiar with and
there's part of me that thinks there's
probably things that you need to do if
it continues to play in your mind jordan
pete is another thing if something
continues to make you cry write it down
um
but i think that you can take it to the

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extreme where you just end up
trying to create just so stories that
sound plausible until you arrive at one
that you then attach and start to see it
as the lens for the world
agreed
all right so you guys you guys sold your
businesses last year somewhere in the
region all together 100 million bucks
something like that
tell me
what
drives you to keep on going once you
have
100 million dollars in your bank account
because
when it comes to usable money
does there's nothing really unless you
have an unbelievably ostentatious taste
there's nothing that you need to buy
that you can't already buy so what
drives you
i mean i think layla and i both see all
the things that we would have done
differently or done better or just
new things that sound exciting that we
because we
caleb and i were just talking about this
before this podcast is that you know
one of the biggest lamentations i have
or the things that i'm bummed about is

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that i
uh i only have one life that i can live
and there's so many lives i'd like to
live in terms of like i'd like to start
a hundred different businesses
throughout my lifetime but i probably
only have you know five
four or five good entrepreneurial
seasons and so we have to be really
really judicious because the way that
lail and i choose to operate in terms of
how we do business is we prefer to have
one big focus and then put all of our
attention to it there are entrepreneurs
who have lots of different things going
on and they enjoy that kind of chaos but
laila and i
prefer to focus you know very hardly on
on one thing and so i think with this
season the thing that gets us excited is
the opportunity that you know we spent
18 months before choosing to sell
crafting and going back and forth with
what business we were going to do next
and we only sold because we were more
excited about this business that we're
building now than the ones that we had
before and so that was kind of our
litmus test and you know as a total side
note for any founders who are thinking
about exiting
i it's my belief that you should be
crystal clear on exactly what you're
going to do next because i've seen so
many of my founder friends et cetera who

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exited and did not have a plan they just
got the check and then they were like
what do i do with my life and they had
no plan layla and i started working the
next day because we were just so excited
to start
building what we're building now
yeah
yeah and i think just to go with that um
in terms of why do we keep doing what
we're doing you know i think that
there's
if you want to become a certain kind of
person right you're like this is who i
see myself when i'm 80 or 90 being it's
a lot easier to become that if you put
yourself in a condition or in a
situation where there's conditions that
put some pressure on you to do that now
should be like immense pressure like
your life is on the line like i don't
really want to do that i don't think i
need that kind of pressure to change but
i think knowing that a company relies on
me knowing that people rely on me
knowing that i've committed to this
mission publicly i think that that kind
of puts like artificial pressure on you
to become the kind of person that you
want to be and i think a lot of people
that are public facing probably have
that too um but i think it works and it
kind of keeps you you know one thing
that we were just talking about before
this is i was like i just never
want to get soft you know we were saying
like we don't want to be soft you know
we've seen a lot of people who sell

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their business and then they just become
honestly like really weird like what
does particularly what does soft look
like to you like i can't go on this trip
unless i have my special pillow you know
or like i absolutely can't stay unless
the hotel has excellent business room is
set is this a byproduct a byproduct of
selling a business for a high amount of
money that you have like odd pillow
connoisseur [ __ ]
well i think it's i think it's when you
have this is we were literally just
talking about this before we got on like
when you have a tremendous amount of
money and you have nothing to do
you still have the same tendencies of
focusing on things but you start
focusing on things that are
trivial in nature now you can make the
argument everything's trivial but let's
just let's forget that one for a moment
and like you start focusing on really
trivial matters but then everyone who's
around you is only there because of
money and so you kind of create this
realm of
suspended reality that you that everyone
in it is is someone who's receiving
money from you and so you don't actually
get feedback from the world anymore and
so you just create more and more
ridiculous beliefs
but you believe them because the
feedback loop is positive and you're

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like oh i guess this isn't ridiculous
but oh yeah if my you know if i can't
fly private somewhere then this is
ridiculous there's no way i'm going it's
like well you know come on let's let's
go if the room isn't 63 degrees and i
have this fluffed pillow and i don't
have this and i can't function
i'm pretty sure good charlotte sang a
song about this not long ago was it
lifestyles of the rich and the famous
they're always complaining
yeah yeah
i mean because if you're not
challenging yourself you don't have
something that you're driving towards
something really that's pulling you
towards the future then i think you're
constantly fighting focusing on the
little stuff that doesn't matter because
your brain doesn't have anything else to
focus on it's nothing to chew on yeah
you know you don't have anything to gnaw
on so you're not on all these little
things that don't matter and they become
these big things and then i see a lot of
people it's like they sell their
businesses they develop weird tendencies
issues like all sorts of stuff maladies
they get sick they're getting weird pain
and they're always like now i can't
start the next thing until i resolve
this problem and i'm like what if you
did the next thing and the problem
resolved itself which we have seen
multiple times happen like they were

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going to all these specialists and they
had all the money right so all the
doctors were happy about some weird
stomach thing
something something
it just goes away once they started just
needed a new business something else 100
and layla and i at least layla and i are
of the belief that um work is required
for a living like you know
i'm not religious but like like
god gave adam work to do before he gave
him a wife like you got a job first
right and so it's it's something that is
quite essential to being human we work
and so i think also in terms of what you
see the goal as like the activities are
the goal like hard work worth doing
is the goal and the byproduct of that
hey if we create the next thing as a
billion or 10 billion or 100 billion
whatever um
i know that we'll enjoy it if because if
someone could just hand us that money we
wouldn't take it or maybe we would take
it but like
but i would still i would take it but i
would still do the exact same thing
we're doing now would still be working
there's some studies that show people
that retire early die way earlier than
the ones that keep on working right this

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is one of the problems this is one of
the problems i think with ubi you know
you can talk about the fact that there
are people who fall through the net who
need to be raised up but for a lot of
people they take their sense of purpose
and pride and belonging and position
within their family and their community
they take that from the job that they do
and don't forget as well that we play
status games you're going to tell me
that you're going to flatten down the
status hierarchy so that there's no one
there is no one that's superior
everybody gets flattened down then what
are they doing what what are people
going to be competing on then we're
going to have some
and that's
the pillow game right it's like oh now
i've decided that i'm going to go and
become a pillow connoisseur
well you know what's funny is like i've
seen it for myself which is you know my
dad was a college professor for almost
32 years um and during covid basically
like you know he was like i he for years
was like i just don't want to do this
anymore i don't like this i'm not
passionate about he was engineering um
and so i was like dad you know at one
point they basically said if you're a
10-year professor we'll offer you two

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years up front pay to leave because they
just knew they could save that in you
know whatever young guy they're going to
bring in and pay less
and he's like isn't this crazy and i was
like yeah crazy if you don't take it you
should take it you hate this thing like
you're done you can move on he had not
thought about it he had literally not
even he's like how crazy are they who
would take this offer like you
should take this offer it's really great
offer
so anyways after like many phone calls
he ended up taking it and
you know he took a little time off and
he was like i need to do something and
one of the companies that we invested in
um they basically do
it's a business that you know basically
there's no marketing there's no sales
it's like an online you know income
generating opportunity passively through
a sort of book publishing type thing and
so i said dad you don't have to talk to
anybody you just get to sit on a screen
you can make this thing try this and my
dad for you know 20 years has always had
like weird aches and pains and he called
me the other day and we were talking
he's like wow i've never had this
feeling before like i wake up at 3am
with ideas like i'm just so immersed in
the community i just love everything
we're doing and what i'm learning and
like he's writing copy he's learning

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00:21:00.000 --> 00:22:00.000
hooks like it's crazy [ __ ] that i never
thought my dad the 60 year old
engineering professor would learn and
then he said neil what's crazy he's like
my back pain and like all my aches have
gone away
and i was like
boom that's it like you're doing what
you love you're focused on something
that you enjoy doing you have like a
worthy challenge and it's just like
those things just disappear
yeah he also broke all my beliefs around
entrepreneurship because i literally
used to use him as the example of what i
would say is like the least
entrepreneurial human being alive
because he was so risk-averse dr kurosh
you know i love you um he's so
risk-averse he was a tenured mechanical
engineer professor who was the
department chair like you cannot get
more secure except maybe a government
position but like it you know i mean
equal
like equal right and him quitting and
making his first dollar online as an
entrepreneur he's like more excited than
ever and that was like now i believe
that everyone can be an entrepreneur
if confronted with the right conditions
so you guys sell this company right and

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you make all of this money and then you
move on to the next thing which is
acquisition.com which is playing proper
big leagues stuff now or at least it's
moving towards playing proper big league
stuff
what are you doing what are you doing
spending all this time on instagram and
making stuff for youtube and things like
that
okay so i'll tell you the one thing is
that we had a lot of time to think about
not just what does the ideal business
look like that you know
achieves our financial goals and the
impact goals but also like what do we
want to do with our time and like what
do we want to be known for and so i
think
realizing that we can have more impact
if we are more known um and through a
series of different conversations that
we had was probably one of the biggest
realizations for both of us because i
think we both prior to that myself more
because i think alex just had to do it
for the business and so he was used to
it um you know enjoyed being more
private um
but we said like at the end of our lives
if we look back you know what will we be
more proud of what will we be what will
take us closer to the version of
ourselves we want to be and it's you
know the mission of the company is to
document and share the best practices of

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building world-class businesses because
you know there's just a lack of people
actually sharing tactically what really
works for building businesses and we're
like what do we want to be known for
it's like we want to be the people that
put better free stuff out there than any
courses that you could buy
and that's just because when we were
coming up and we were building the
businesses like the amount of pain you
have to endure because it's relative
pain right like is this real pain like
no we're not in like africa like
starving or anything like that but like
it feels terrible like you feel like
you're gonna die sometimes which is like
ridiculous but you do when you have to
like fire someone or a client steals
something or someone says they're gonna
sue you like these things feel horrible
and if we can just save people that pain
and make them realize like one that's
all completely normal and it's just part
of business and you're okay and it's
absolutely fine um and it's just so you
need to accept but then two here's the
tools that we wish we had had when we
were doing it that if you use these you
could probably at least mitigate the
pain
yeah that's a good that's a good reason
i mean also as well
when you think about what you guys are
doing
with acquisition.com

25
00:24:00.000 --> 00:25:00.000
expediting someone's degree of trust in
you
to come in with some social status you
know that no one
the likelihood of you screwing somebody
over when tons and tons of thousands of
people on the internet know who you are
decreases massively because the scandal
would be way higher everyone's concerned
everyone likes the idea of like the the
secret master that lives in the cave
that nobody knows about but nobody would
trust him
that's interesting i haven't thought
about like that i haven't thought about
that angle yeah
for and from so layla covered kind of
one angle of why we're doing it the
other you know from a utilitarian's
perspective like we have a lot of
leverage that we can employ to do this
so like we can we can compensate people
to do a lot of work on our behalf that
that can expand what looks like a lot of
time when and really like you know if we
do two podcasts a week it's not a
tremendous amount of time investment but
if those get chopped up and repurposed
and you know across all the platforms
and the long forms go out and we have
podcast pieces like all that stuff can
get done if there's people who can run

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it and running teams is something that
we're very you know we're fine doing
that and so from a time time to output
ratio there's much more output than
there is input and that's kind of the
nature of building wealth in general um
in terms of the strategy
behind it with acquisition.com i think
you're 100 right because when i looked
at there was like i had i'll do it as
fast as i can but i had probably five or
six things that happened in a row that
on on one angle when we started this i
had no desire to ever be famous i just
wanted to be rich and that was and i
said that publicly i was like i just
want to be rich i don't care about being
famous i want no one to know who i am
but
then kylie became a billionaire at 20.
and that really affected me because i
was 20 i think i don't know whatever i
you know and i and i honestly was like
depressed for a day and i was like why
do i suck so much like why am i so bad
at everything i am just the worst right
i was like i feel like i know more about
business but i have oh i have the
fundamental belief that if someone's
making more money than me they are
better than me in some way at the game
of business and i have to learn what
that is right and so
that happened and then uh

27
00:26:00.000 --> 00:27:00.000
conor mcgregor came out with uh proper
12 and it's now a 600 million dollar
enterprise and then the rock has terra
mana which is probably worth between two
and four billion right now
and so i was like man having these
massive audiences to people who weren't
even necessarily business folks
instantly gave them billion dollar
status and i was like
that's interesting so that was like big
belief breaker number one i still didn't
want to do it because i was like it's
not worth it i can just do it in the
shadows and do the billion either way
and just have no one know who i am but
then we had a conversation with dean
graciosi who's tony robbins right-hand
man very good friend of ours and he said
and i was like don't you get weirded out
by people like leaving weird messages at
your door and like you know just being
weird uh he said
if that's the price i have to pay for
the impact i want to have i would do it
every single day of the week and when he
said that it like really hit both of us
because as as after we left the house i
was like did you hear that she's like
yeah i know i thought about it and so
that was actually that was the turning

28
00:27:00.000 --> 00:28:00.000
point for us where we said if this is
the impact that we want to have we're
willing to pay the price
of you know some of the the negative
aspects of becoming more known and so
that was that was that was the big part
and from a strategy perspective you know
you got it it's much it's much easier
charlie margaret talks about this but
like trust is the ultimate lubricant in
business it makes business transactions
much more fluid faster etc and it's
long-term greed for both parties if you
can actually maintain trust and so the
idea is if we can just put lots of stuff
out there and that is valuable people
can utilize already know it works then
we kind of operate on shared trust from
the get-go and it saves
it just saves so much time so much
effort and it makes
everything that we're doing better so
that's that's the big picture for us on
a strategy well think as well about the
fact that as you're putting this content
out there's going to be future potential
partners that you're going to work with
with acquisition.com that are going to
see that stuff everybody this is
something i thought the other day you
know elon musk doom scrolls youtube
everybody does everybody doomscrolls
everything like so you don't know if

29
00:28:00.000 --> 00:29:00.000
you're putting content out there you
don't know which person that you might
really value connecting with some dude
some guy that was on pretty little
liars and is filming in austin reached
out because he loves some episode never
seen an episode of pretty little liars
this guy's got
20 million followers on instagram and
it's like a heartthrob of heartthrobs
and all this stuff and i was like oh
cool like we didn't we haven't had a
chance to catch up but it's it's if i
needed a guy from pretty little liars at
some point i've got one you know
i'm starting to acquire the pretty
little liars community
you know what's funny is because like we
were talking about the other day i was
telling caleb i was like i've had a
bunch of like famous rappers reach out
and they're like dude i love your
content and i'm like very famous you
would know they are and i was like what
and you know like beyond confused and
i'm like they follow me and then i was
like and he's like yeah people like if
you have good content you just never
know who's gonna see it i'm like wow you
know everybody dooms girls man everybody
do scrolls that's that's the lesson so
i've heard you talk alex before about um

30
00:29:00.000 --> 00:30:00.000
the fragility of a morning routine
basically sort of relating that to uh
kind of like superstition that you
create a particular standard for your
day that if it's not met you begin to
have a sort of a negative thought loop
about the fact that you haven't prepared
yeah you can't deny though that there
are certain ways that are better to
prepare for things and other ways that
are worse to prepare for things if you
were you you're going to make sure that
you eat and sleep and drink and you know
do the things
how do you balance those two how do you
guys both now
have enough structure in your day that
allows you to stay focused on the things
that you need to
whilst not committing this sort of
superstition fallacy around having a
very precarious put together daily
routine
yeah i think it's more i mean to use
layla's one of laila's isms uh it's more
a dichotomy to be managed than a problem
to be solved
so i think it's really just managing the
balance between those things i think you
know if you sleep well
yeah i think everyone can agree that
they feel better if they sleep well but

31
00:30:00.000 --> 00:31:00.000
the question is if you then create the
story that i must sleep well it's all
the shoulds have to need to all those
all of that language
if you make it a requirement to function
then that is where i would say the
positive of having the belief that you
it is it helps you is more
you get more negative ramifications from
having the belief that you must have it
whereas if you see it as a preference
i prefer to sleep more but if i don't
sleep i'm still going to show up because
like winners win and so i think having
different beliefs around behaviors is
more useful it has had higher utility in
my life
yeah i would say that just echoing that
um
i think a lot of high performers people
who call themselves high performers put
like an absorbent amount of pressure on
themselves and so
basically trying to control things to an
extent where the control that you're
trying to exert on those things adds
more pressure than if you were to not do
the thing itself right so if you're like
i must you know eat this way sleep this
way drink this way and feel this way to
have my speech tomorrow and then you

32
00:31:00.000 --> 00:32:00.000
know you miss a flight and you don't get
a meal and then you sleep like [ __ ] and
you wake up and you whatever you have a
pimple and then it's like you [ __ ]
fall apart right and so but we can't
control a lot of those things we just
only have the illusion of control and i
think a lot of people those routines
create even more illusion of control
than
you know people who don't have them and
so you know like for myself if i have
like a big speech the next day or i have
like a huge day i actually like prepare
myself i'm like i'm probably gonna feel
like [ __ ] probably asleep like [ __ ] i'm
gonna feel like i need a stomachache a
headache like i'll just think all that
i'm like i'm gonna [ __ ] crush it
anyways because that's like that helps
me think well then everything else is
gravy because i know i can feel like
absolute just
terrible and i'm still gonna perform so
that relieves the pressure and also
takes away that need to feel like i have
to control the situations like make sure
everything's happening at the right time
so i'm doing all these things and having
all these routines because i feel like a
lot of people kind of spin up in that
way and then there's so much pressure
from that it actually makes it worse
yeah i think net net it's also just way
less decision fatigue with less mental
effort just not like just not even

33
00:32:00.000 --> 00:33:00.000
worrying about it and just thinking like
it's a it's preferences with an
overshadowing or an umbrella of
acceptance prefer these things but
either way i'll accept whatever whatever
happens i always like to tell myself i'm
like
life is not always fair i'm like i don't
deserve to feel good today like there's
no like i deserve to feel good like i
should be feeling great right now i'm
like i feel like [ __ ] and like life like
i don't deserve to feel anyway
well think about what the more heroic
narrative of those two is as well the
much more heroic narrative is i didn't
sleep right didn't eat right had an
argument with the misses this morning
and i'm still going to go out there and
and close this there's a great story
from ben bergeron when he's talking
about um the crossfit games in 2017 or
18 and it was the first day
of the games and they didn't realize
that they were going to be flown out one
day before the entire set of games
started they were told that they needed
to be downstairs with passports and bags
no coaches no nothing else and they
basically went and did an entire extra
day of programming out at the crossfit

34
00:33:00.000 --> 00:34:00.000
ranch nobody knew everybody was on the
plane it was four hours sleep no one had
their coaches with them maybe somebody
had left a special weight belt at home
and stuff like that and you had two
types of athletes in this situation you
had one that said oh my god i don't have
all of the right things and the other
one that said
i've trained for this i've gone into the
gym a ton of times when i haven't slept
enough and i've said what an awesome
opportunity for me to see whether or not
i can still eat [ __ ]
whilst not being fully prepared from the
day before and that i think is is like
similar to
the ethos that you guys have got here
100
what was that paradox to be solved
dichotomy to be managed thing
um
it was a actually i got it from a book
you know esther perel
yep
yeah so she talked about uh desire and
basically you know a lot of people think
like wanting more desire or having you
know not having enough security or not
having enough desire are like problems
to solve like i need to feel more secure

35
00:34:00.000 --> 00:35:00.000
with my spouse or i need to feel more
desire with my spouse and she said it's
not
a problem to be solved but a dichotomy
to be managed and she kind of went on a
little rant how people in america always
want to solve these things thinking
everything's a problem whereas they're
not problems they're just dichotomies
that need to be managed and i took that
and i was like wow this applies to
everything that i see in business things
in your personal life things and pretty
much everywhere where everyone's like
how do i solve this problem you're like
it's not a problem it really exists like
on a pendulum and you want to make sure
that it doesn't swing too far one way or
the other but that you're able to manage
it so it kind of just stays in the
middle at all points in time and i think
that a lot of humans are really good at
getting something to one side or getting
assigned to the other side but they're
not great at keeping things in the
middle it's like moderation is actually
usually harder than going to one extreme
um so we just probably both use that a
lot with different aspects yeah and just
for for the audience for examples here
it's like a dichotomy would be like
justice and mercy they're both both
ideals but you don't want to solve for
perfect justice because then most people
would say that that's probably not
perfect justice in absence of any mercy
is probably not the ideal outcome if

36
00:35:00.000 --> 00:36:00.000
we're just talking from a values
perspective and so the same thing can be
translated in business language which
would be like uh
delegation versus micromanagement right
okay well these are these are two
extremes like we we're not solving to
eliminate delegation we're not solving
to eliminate micromanagement we're
assault or abdication rather um we're
trying to find that middle ground so
it's a dichotomy to manage rather than a
problem to be solved
and i think that a lot of humans when
you see something you immediately label
as a problem and then you overcompensate
to solve it which then swings you in
very far in one direction you know it's
like you don't perform well on something
and so you think i'm a piece of [ __ ] i'm
a failure x y and z i need to go take a
course on this get a coach do all these
things but it's like in reality maybe
you need to tweak two things or maybe
it's not even a problem to begin with
yeah maybe it's okay to suck maybe it's
okay this is the narrative that we come
back to again right the framing that you
put through things if you want a lot
more control if you want to be able to
fix the problems then you're going to
see every dichotomy is not just a little
bit of discomfort that is par for the
course of being a human maybe a human
trying to run a business with a family
with a life with some pursuits and some

37
00:36:00.000 --> 00:37:00.000
hobbies it's like well yeah obviously
there's going to be there's going to be
paradoxes in there obviously like
there's always going to be things that
are difficult for you to work out so
given the fact that you are uh at least
preferences with uh your acceptance over
the top of it how do you avoid
losing focus throughout the day i i
wouldn't like to guess how many
opportunities and phone calls and
different things and bits and pieces you
guys have potentially got to do
what is it that you do to ensure that
the day stays focused and that the
things that need to get done get done
we have different ways of of running our
days dramatically different and i think
part of that is because of the nature of
the work that we do is somewhat
different
and so for me
i've i've probably only had two habits
that i would ascribe the majority of my
productivity to
um you know the first one is that i wake
up early and i begin work early
and for me that has worked i think it's
more but i also have multiple friends
who are billionaires who they work
really late at night

38
00:37:00.000 --> 00:38:00.000
and so i don't think it's like mornings
are important or evenings are important
i think what's more important is to have
dedicated time to think without
distraction and so for me it works
better in the mornings and so
that's habit one and habit one paired
with habit two which is that i don't
take meetings before lunch
and so i will have between 5 a.m until
noon roughly to have seven hours of more
or less uninterrupted work to do
whatever it is that i want to do to move
things forward to work on projects to
create sops presentations whatever it is
and then after that i can correspond
with the team respond to slacks and
emails and all the other things that
kind of pull you in a million directions
and
i've been more or less doing that for
years and that has worked for me um i
don't have any other
your job role has changed right you've
done different things throughout that
time but you've found that that same get
up early and avoid interacting with
other people until around about midday
has served you well across all of the
different domains that you've had to do
yes and i would still even say even

39
00:38:00.000 --> 00:39:00.000
though my role has changed the nature of
my work is not is not too dissimilar um
over that same time period what i was
working on might have changed but the
nature of the work has not and what's
the difference for you laila what do you
do
i think because the nature of my role
you know i need to be a little more
available to people and a little more um
not in a cupboard
yeah i try to also keep my mornings
clear uh at least like early mornings
because i know that i have my list that
i you know i always have a working list
basis like backlog what do i need to get
done this week and then today and so
it's like i try to get my today tasks
done before i start my meetings but if i
don't because things pop up and i gotta
hop on a meeting at seven or at you know
6 30 or whatever it is then i will and
i'll just be flexible in terms of like i
have my things that need to get done but
i can be flexible when they get done if
that makes sense and then i would say
that in terms of staying focused
if i'm looking at all the things that
pop up during the day if i'm feeling
like i can't get done what i said i'm
going to get done for that day then i'm
not thinking strategically enough what
i'm typically not doing is i'm not

40
00:39:00.000 --> 00:40:00.000
thinking who else can do this besides me
that's usually when
it's when it's i can absolutely get
these things done if i focus on the most
important ones that only i can do and so
what i'll do is i'll look at my list if
i have like 17 things and i'll say these
are all the things i'm going to delegate
and here's what i'm going to delete too
and then i just go do it immediately and
then i go back to focusing on my thing
and so
i was going to say i've just observed
layla doing this so just to give more
context for the audience like
she has now
tuned her like mental muscle to whenever
she gets this like level of i don't want
to say overwhelm but like backlog of
stuff that needs to be done that you
know i would say earlier days having
observed her she would just like stress
out sleep you know sleep less try and
you know try and get it all done and now
she uses that as a warning flag or a red
flag where she's like oh i probably
needed to go i need to delegate this
stuff and so her like auto correction
cycle has you know sped up faster and
faster since since we've been together
doing this it's just a threshold that
you meet and then at that point you
start kicking some stuff out the side
yep yeah yeah and i think honestly it's

41
00:40:00.000 --> 00:41:00.000
usually a little bit reactive
unfortunately like i should have been
delegating those things anyways because
my team has capacity and it's an
opportunity for them to learn and to
take on more responsibility and so i'm
doing them a disservice when i forget to
do those things so but it's uh i'm
probably in a season right now where
uh for a
good amount of time it was like me doing
everything and then you know because
even though we have all you know we have
the resources to like we could have
built a team of you know 50 from day one
it doesn't make sense for a business and
it's in my opinion it's not the right
way to build the business if you want
the outcome that we want like i do not
think that everything's shaped at once i
don't think that hiring 10 or 15 people
overnight is ideal so we're trying to do
things gradually and i'm okay with being
in some pain doing that um but i have to
also then remind myself like oh you've
been in the habit of doing a lot now
you've gotta get in the habit of
starting to delegate more
because when i left gym launch i was
only delegating there was barely any
doing and then i had to switch back to
doing and now it's kind of like a mix in
the middle
when it comes to hiring people whether

42
00:41:00.000 --> 00:42:00.000
this be for personal law for business
what are some of the most important
things or roles to hire for when you
begin to start making money how do you
outsource your life in a way that
facilitates you guys to do as much as
you can
i think general advice for people would
be that the first thing that you want to
do is you want to outsource anything
that's non-general non-revenue
generating so a lot of people
because they're spending all their time
doing sales or marketing they think i
should go get somebody to do sales and
marketing
but in reality you don't want to
outsource the thing that makes the money
and that you're good at you want to
outsource the things that you're bad at
and probably aren't making money like
the fact that you're probably doing your
own books the fact that you're answering
all the customer support questions the
fact that you know you're the primary
source of value or innovation in the
product and so i think there's a lot of
things that you want to outsource first
it's usually things that you suck at and
uh don't like doing that's what i
usually like to say and then adding on
top of that that are non-revenue
generating so it's just like do you suck
at it do you uh hate it and then does it

43
00:42:00.000 --> 00:43:00.000
not generate revenue then it probably
makes sense to outsource that first
what about personal life chef cleaner
gardener
masseuse
yeah except i think there's trade-offs
which is like you know we've outsourced
everything we've had like house manager
and stuff like that and like we do
outsource a lot like cleaning and food
and things like that we just i mean we
just don't eat much besides dinner but
um
it's at some point when you outsource so
much then you actually have like a team
you're managing so what you have to kind
of ask yourself is
would i rather do the thing or would i
rather manage the person
like i know for us having a house
manager and having a big house like we
literally are not getting a house
because people like dude you don't have
to manage your own house i'm like oh
we're aware but we don't want to manage
the people that are going to be running
the house
we just don't care enough there's a lot
of extra decisions that have to be made
constantly on the house like you've got
i mean if you have a bigger home you've
got landscapers av guys the pool guy the
you know the cleaners the the laundry
people like the cooks like there's all

44
00:43:00.000 --> 00:44:00.000
these other things that people don't
think about and uh you know we did it
and we're like this is terrible like i'd
rather have a tiny
tiny footprint and have and just and we
get our
our food delivered we eat it that's it
it goes straight in the trash we dump it
down at the call next the hallway next
to the elevator done like we it's all
it's all you know the cleaners come
twice a week when we're not here it's
just simple
i think
optimizing for uh as little friction and
as little annoyance as possible
especially if that's like you can't get
away from the annoyance in your business
that's literally what you're paid for
you're paid to make difficult decisions
right that are hard to work out and then
to come home and find out that
paulo's not being this week so they've
had to get somebody else in to do the
pool and and that's been a nightmare and
oh do you like the payment's not gone
through oh it's because someone changed
their account like no no no no yeah that
does make a lot of sense although i
didn't i didn't think about houses that
were so big that you basically need a
a second business yeah
yeah all right and then you i mean you

45
00:44:00.000 --> 00:45:00.000
have your own problems that staff you
know one time we were running our
quarterly meeting and our house manager
we'd had for like five months i guess
her boyfriend broke up with her so she
comes in we're running the quarterly
meeting just a friggin mess makeup
everywhere bawling and we're like
howling really like yeah it's almost
like scream crying and we're like uh and
then we're like obviously we would send
this woman home but we had a huge
delivery of gym equipment coming that
day and so we're like you know we're
running this court and being like just
sit in the garage and just tell them not
to break anything please and she's like
sobbing carrying carrying kettlebells in
like wiping tears away with kettlebells
and stuff
this is not even an exaggeration yes and
so you know it comes with its own it's
like if you want to have we would just
rather not have enough stuff that we
need a lot of people to outsource it to
would you say
because you guys had nice house houses
austin
fancy car last year got rid of it all
i've been playing around with this idea
for ages about your materialism set
point
so kind of like a a degree of

46
00:45:00.000 --> 00:46:00.000
manifested wealth in the things that you
have that impacts your level of
happiness
it seems like you guys kind of
uh tested the water last year to see if
having more stuff would make you happier
and
the answer came back as a resounding no
is that right
more or less and i would say it wasn't
like we tested it last year i would say
it was slowly accumulated and then we
just looked around and we're like i and
you know we traveled um
not that not that long ago to a um
a just a tiny little place and we had
been only in our massive house for a
while and we were there for a few weeks
and i was like i don't need more than
this like i like not having all the
excess i feel less wasteful and i
remember when i threw away like 90 of
the clothing that i had
i felt better every time i walked into
my closet and i was like man this
conferred not even not even neutral it
was a negative like having more stuff
was negative and so that was kind of
eye-opening at least for me um and layla
and i have have slight differences in
preferences around those things and so
those are a little bit more individual

47
00:46:00.000 --> 00:47:00.000
but for us i think i probably have a
lower materialism set point than layla
does um mine is arguably very
but it's odd you understand that most
most high net worth individuals
that's outwardly expressed right and not
through
that yeah they've you know like you are
worth a lot of money it's obvious that
you're worth a lot of money and not
through like real niche things like
expensive flannel shirts and like
you know
trips trips away with friends and stuff
like that like through actual
ostentatious like horse [ __ ] so yeah i
wonder whether it's kind of back to the
start you know how you were talking
about people become rich and then they
start sort of obsessing over certain
things i wonder whether there's an
expectation that when you're rich you do
the things that rich people do what do
rich people do or will rich people blow
loads of money on art that they don't
care about and multiple homes and blah
blah blah i i wonder whether there's an
expectation effect going on there
and you know the thing is it's like it's
just not stimulating like picking out
like random pieces of art like what
chandelier are we going to import from
italy like the stuff that some people

48
00:47:00.000 --> 00:48:00.000
that i know like kind of focus on i'm
like it's not enjoyable for me at all
like it's just it's not it's not
stimulating it's very boring it's almost
like drudgery yeah we're not fans some
people are though like i was having we
had a conversation earlier with a friend
of ours and he uh he was talking about
cars he like loves cars so he has like
multiple ferraris all that stuff and i
was like
like you love this you know like i don't
love this but if i had a at-home gym or
we built a gym in the office like i do
love having great gym equipment like i
enjoy that like it the cost-to-benefit
ratio is in my favor to obsess about it
i'll look up new equipment i follow
equipment things to see what new
equipment's coming like i like it so i
understand it's just for us we don't
it's i think it's making sure that the
reason that you're buying it is because
you want to buy it not because you
believe you should be buying it yeah
like i like certain expensive clothing
or jewelry and i'll buy it but like
it doesn't like it's not like i'm doing
it for i do it for myself you know what
i mean like people like oh you bought
that because of x y i'm like when i was

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a kid i had like fake bling all over
like i love shiny big things like now i
can buy real ones sure i'm gonna buy it
well it's the same with going out for
nice dinners right i think that's one
thing that very few people ever regret
doing i've never regretted unless the
dinner was of terrible quality i've
never regretted going out and spending a
lot of money on dinner going back to to
sort of the decisions and stuff i'm
really interested in this tension
between um sort of thinking and feeling
that you guys have had when it's come to
making decisions so it seems like a lot
of the decisions have been made with an
insight of thinking right there's a bit
of inspiration there but a good bit of
just sort of gut and commitment
it's the way that you guys met was you
basically saying you want to start
working together and then from there
very quickly lilla's going around
collecting cash for you on your behalf
like that
you can't
you can't have thought your way through
all of those things right you you can't
have logically played out every single
step so there has to be a a little bit
of insight and then a ton of gut that
just says yeah we should go for this or
you upped sticks and decided to move to

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00:49:00.000 --> 00:50:00.000
like california to go and
work in some guy's gym you just rocked
up and he wasn't even expecting you like
that again it's a little bit of insight
but a ton of good and
increasingly i see maybe it's been since
coveted as well a lot of people are in
their own heads people are very cerebral
they rely on cognitive horsepower to get
themselves through things and that stops
them sometimes from tapping into that
more sort of gut intuitive sense is that
attention that you ever feel
sort of knowing that something's right
and stopping yourself from talking
yourself out of something that is good
this is definitely something i'm sure
and i will both enjoy jamming on um
at least i am of the belief that you
learn a lot more through doing than you
do through thinking um not to say not to
counter what i was saying before um but
like from a learning perspective you
learn more uh from doing now there are
some lessons that are worth not doing
not
learning without doing you're right um
but i think that both of us would agree
that when we are afraid to do something
and i would say it's it's a fear
it's not like jumping out of a building
that's that's the good fear you know

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what i mean but fear of failure fear of
risk uh like starting a business
i mean there
i guess there is some sort of gut
reaction that that has to that has to
happen um i feel like this is a poor
answer that i gave actually a gut
reaction isn't
yeah i think i gave a poor answer
um
you know i i know for myself at least
like i've never
it's it's you could say it's gut to like
maybe pull the trigger but it's probably
things i've thought about for a long
time so like when i moved to california
you know like immediately after i
graduated like i was like that makes
sense to move to california because
logically i know that the industry there
is booming that i want to be in so it
makes sense to move there you know when
i met alex he literally fit the bill for
like every single thing that i've been
looking for in someone and i just knew
everything
[Laughter]
and i just knew
that like i'm like leela if he matches
everything that you've been looking for
like why are you waiting on this like
just do it you know and so i think it's

52
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usually been they're supporting evidence
yeah and it's like they're supporting
evidence that's obviously there but my
brain is going crazy usually being like
fear fear like scared fear of unknown
and i just say like oh my god my brain
is freaking out right now but i am
totally aware that this makes no logical
sense and so i'm able to talk myself
into being like
my brain is making these wacko stories
again you know it's not like i'm telling
i'm not saying i'm crazy you're making
wacko stories but my brain is making
them up i'm like you've got to go do it
anyways and so i think for me at least
that's usually how i've gotten myself to
take action it's just like there's i pay
attention way more to the evidence in
the situation rather than the belief
that i may have because oftentimes the
belief comes after you do something you
know i think most things that i've done
in life i have not believed that they
would be possible until after i did them
even now it's like i know this is my
thing it happens with every business we
have like we lay out the numbers and
it's like here's what we're gonna get to
and i'm like
yeah it makes complete sense in my mind
i'm like oh i don't think so
and then we get there then i'm like oh
that was nice but it's like every time
still like i still and a lot of people i
think think you have to have the belief

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you gotta believe in yourself to do it
i'm like no you don't like i have not
believed there's so many of the things
that i've been able to do and to like a
very large degree too
and just as a as a one-liner um like we
are of the belief that
it doesn't it doesn't take time to make
decisions it takes information to make
decisions and if you have the
information to make the decision then
you should make it and so a lot of
people will belabor a decision when they
are not gaining more information to make
it now if you have emotions that are
involved and you want to decrease the
time you know so that you can be less
emotional then i can understand that but
decisions are time is not a requirement
of decision making like information is
and so if you have the right if you have
the evidence that would support it so
that's probably to delineate what i was
saying earlier like good fear or bad
fear like if you have the evidence that
would support that this is a good
decision then if you still have fear
then that is more fear of the unknown
or of the hypothetical which is not
knowable we don't know what's going to
happen but we have this evidence that so
support that this decision makes sense
if we still don't want to make it that
is not logical and so it's making sure

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that we can recognize like logical
versus illogical fear
i saw a tweet from you a little while
ago saying uh nine months into dating
layla i lost everything i had i stared
at her and said i'm a sinking ship if
you want to leave me i 100 respect that
at which point she grabbed my chin to
tilt my head up to meet her eyes and
said i'd sleep with you under a bridge
if it came to that what's the story
there
ah the layla and alex love story um so i
um
so i had a chain of gyms laila came in
she started collecting cash for me i
wanted to start the gym launch business
um i started flying around doing these
launches they started working she quit
her job followed me we started doing
launches together um
series of unfortunate events uh
i
there are multiple i'll tell you there's
three big ones but i'll they're fine
there's like six big ones but i'll give
you the highlight version uh i had a
head-on dui uh that i got in head-on
collision uh right after that i put all
the money from selling my five gyms into
a new company um and then the partner
that i had in that new company ended up

55
00:54:00.000 --> 00:55:00.000
taking the money um after that i thought
we were like okay clean slate we lost
everything you know uh we're at zero and
we then did another launch to give us
cash to do the next business we had
about a hundred thousand dollars we're
supposed to come in which when you have
zero hundred thousand was a lot um
didn't come got on the phone with the uh
processors like every single day for ten
days straight and then finally and they
kept giving me the runaround
and then on that day they were like oh
uh we're not going to give it to you and
so uh the last money that i had was at
twenty three thousand dollars left to my
name i owed the salesman who had made
the hundred thousand dollars in sales
twenty two thousand dollars in
commissions so i had one thousand
dollars left and so i paid him the 22 on
money that i hadn't received and so the
next day uh and this is christmas eve so
on the 26th uh i would and that's when i
found out um mind you at this point is
when i'm meeting layla's family for the
first time uh the guy from the internet
that she quit her job for and are
immediately sleeping together in motels
around the country so her father loved
me dr crosh for the win um

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00:55:00.000 --> 00:56:00.000
this guy's a winner and so i now lost
everything multiple times he's like this
guy knows what he's doing and so uh
christmas eve find out that we're not
gonna get the money christmas day
happens uh and on the 26th she had
gotten six of her friends pretty all of
her friends from high school to quit
their jobs to start this next business
with us and this is before i didn't know
that i wasn't going to get the money to
start the business so they had all quit
their jobs and it was spark starting 48
hours later and for that model to work
we were going to spend 3 300 a day
per day
on advertising hotels airfare rental
cars per diems for food for all of these
sales guys all six of them to fly out to
these locations and then do the launches
that we were doing successfully
and so uh
it was at that moment where i said
i have a hundred thousand limit on this
credit card which i still had from my
gym that amex hadn't canceled yet so for
whatever reason i still had the credit
limit they didn't know that my life was
in shambles
and uh i'm at her parents house sleeping
in their in their room because we

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00:56:00.000 --> 00:57:00.000
couldn't afford anything and at this
moment
i was like okay
this could go horribly wrong uh i'm
about to spend i'm going to be going
into debt at 3 300 a day
and given my track record up to this
point which has been now all failure um
i think it would be wise for you to exit
uh because this is probably not gonna be
pretty but i really don't know what else
i'm gonna do so i'm gonna do it when i
it was like i i think i'm a sinking ship
right now like nothing else has worked
and so like i respect you if you want to
dip out like i we're cool and so that
was when she said she would she would
stay with me and so um for me that was a
big a big moment where i knew that she
was
she was going she was willing to hang
with me when [ __ ] was going to be hard
and i knew that where i wanted to go was
not going to be calm waters and i knew i
needed somebody who wanted to be next to
me and would want to weather those
storms and so a lot of people can claim
that very few people can walk it and she
did and so she gave me evidence to
support that and so i felt i mean for us

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to get you know married after that both
of us were like yeah i think we should
get married and we didn't have any
stress about it and just got married six
days later and it was not from that
point but you know a few months later
and yeah and so it's been it's been the
same since
how is that from your perspective leila
um
you know i think there's a few things
which is like you know when i
when we started doing everything
together you know not to sound you know
i'm super young alex has like a lot
going on it was a lot of chaos and i
didn't know how he was gonna turn out
and i just kept i i kind of just always
play out worst case scenario like worst
case scenarios i end up at my dad's
house like hey i like stopped doing
everything i was doing i gave up all my
clients i like stopped pursuing my own
stuff started do this thing with this
guy and it didn't work and so what i
start over like i'm 23 who cares you
know i've gained a ton of experience and
a ton of knowledge and i've had a lot of
good you know takeaways from that stuff
and so that was kind of my mindset going
into everything
um
but then you know upon like getting to

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00:58:00.000 --> 00:59:00.000
know alex and seeing everything i think
i just had like this
unwavering belief in him um despite
circumstances evidence like despite
evidence to the country
and honestly like i think that the way
that i saw it was i was like he's so
brilliant i just don't think that he has
been surrounded by the right people like
i think there's a lot of people that are
around him that didn't necessarily
amplify his strengths or maybe took
advantage of his strengths or maybe yeah
i want to say and not everyone because
he had some really great partners but
there were some that i think
you know we were both young it's just
like and i was like if he just was in a
different situation didn't have 17
businesses and had people who actually
really believed in him and supported him
like i really think that he could
he's going to do something huge and so
i think i just always saw that and i
always wanted to be the person that
could help bring his vision to life just
because
you know and i have i probably have more
vision now than i did then but
but i've always wanted to be the person
i can do that for somebody that has that
and he has so much to give that i think

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00:59:00.000 --> 01:00:00.000
when he said that it was almost like
funny to me i was like i'm not going
anywhere you know because
i could just see it and i remember there
were so many moments where it was really
tough for us and i could just see i was
like i just know that there's a version
of us that gets out of this and is
great together and i think that we can
make some really big [ __ ] and i think
that just seeing the amount of progress
we were even able to make while going
through all that stuff first stressful
stuff i was like imagine what it'll be
like we don't have these kind of
circumstances how much progress we'll be
able to make in our lives in our
relationship and in our business and so
i think it's
you know just being able to see the
worst of someone but still see the light
in them um
because it's not hard i think you know
everyone now is like you bought low like
you must have seen it coming and i was
stuck yeah no no he was he was an idiot
i think it's just you know i see it a
lot and we see a lot and like people
that have businesses you know we're like
when we picked the business as an
acquisition.com it's like i see it in so
many of them and they probably resonate
with alex like they just see the right
people around them they've got people
who are taking advantage of them they've

61
01:00:00.000 --> 01:01:00.000
got people who don't understand them
they've got people who are telling them
their dreams are too big and it sucks
and so i think you know i've just always
wanted to support someone who does have
that like big creative vision like alex
does and that means also being there
when [ __ ] sucks
and mind it like this was the first like
seven months of us being together like
that everything i just said all happened
the first seven months of us being
together and i remember there were a
couple of like refrains that we went
back to and she was like think about how
epic this story is going to be like when
we make it you know what i mean like how
cool is that going to be you know for us
and so that was that was always like
very powerful
and
i think i always valued
loyalty above love
um because i just
like me personally it was just something
that was very meaningful for me because
i
she was just always down you know what i
mean and like i was like this [ __ ]
might not work and she's like cool let's
go you know what i mean like giddy up
and um
and like in my first book i said like
ride or die and i mean i very much like

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01:01:00.000 --> 01:02:00.000
layla and i are not religious but in the
bible there's only one thing that it
says about picking a mate like literally
only one everything else is about
marriage but only one thing about
picking the right person
and in it it's an old testament verse
and it says that you should pick someone
that you would go to war with
and
i think that's a really interesting
frame to think about for like selecting
a mate
and it felt like we were going through a
battle the entire time and i can say
truthfully like the first 12 months of
our relationship were significantly
harder than any period that we've had
since most people like marriage gets
harder over time it hasn't been that way
for us i'm not trying to do anything but
i mean the first 12 months were tough
um and so we're like well if we can get
through being broke multiple times
losing everything stabbing the bag dui
my mom was in the hospital uh after
i'll just
put it out
tough circumstances
all of that in that same period of time
um if we can get through that then like
the rest of it should be easy
which has been true which is more or

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01:02:00.000 --> 01:03:00.000
less been true well it's a baptism of
fire if you start it off
so difficult that nothing after that can
be any more difficult
so we can only give up from here you
know yeah and that's what i kept telling
no
i can't get poorer how do you so one of
one of the things that you talk about is
is the fact that um you've obviously got
this sort of collaborative vision you
guys are working together even though
you try and separate your days a little
bit which i think is quite interesting
that you're working separately so that
if you sit down at dinner on a night
time you can actually say how was your
day and you don't just go you were there
idiot like
i was with you um
how do you avoid becoming bros instead
of lovers
i think that's been something that has
taken time you know i think that in the
beginning it was a conversation that we
would actively have which is like i feel
like we're spending so much time
together um
and i think it's because we also haven't
really figured out
how to
you know separate things at you know how

64
01:03:00.000 --> 01:04:00.000
to distinctively separate our roles how
to kind of like come into there's the
things we do together and the things we
do apart we have our own interests and
things like that still um and i think
now we've come to a point where we're
much more
defined in terms of what each of us do
and then what we do together and we have
a lot of shared interests which is
really nice because that means that
outside of work we have things that we
enjoy both enjoy as well but we also
have things that we like and do
differently you know like if people
observe us on a daily basis they would
think they are very different a lot of
things they do as well
and so i think the way that you don't
become that is you always you're always
looking at ways that you can add in
variety and i think that the ways that
we add in variety are doing new things
together especially you know i think
that if you're doing constantly the work
together because a lot of people have
spouses you know they're working
together doing that same stuff what you
want to do is like go travel together go
to new restaurants together go watch a
new show together go meet new friends
together and so
it's not that um you need to change
anything about the work but probably
adding in things of more variety to your

65
01:04:00.000 --> 01:05:00.000
relationship and so i think like us i
love when we travel together and we go
meet new people together and we go do
new experiences together and i think we
do a lot more of that now than we used
to because i think one we both just like
it but also i think that's really good
for a relationship
and if we didn't have you know the means
that we have now i would we could still
do the same thing we just do like
staycations you know you spend 100 or
200 bucks for a day or two at a hotel
for the weekend just you know 30 minutes
away and it just it feels like an
entirely different experience
uh even though it's not that far off and
uh like little things like that changing
the environmental conditions can still
give you that kind of novel variety and
then um i mean i'm really more quoting
layla here but uh it's just creating
space to be missed you know i think if
you if you've been with someone for a
long time and then all of a sudden you
don't see them for a week you're like oh
my god like when you see them again
you're like i just [ __ ] missed you i
love you so much my god this is great
and so it's like how can we create you
know how can we how do we purposely
separate our our days like we always
work on separate sides of our home we

66
01:05:00.000 --> 01:06:00.000
really don't attend the same meetings uh
we pretty much have our meals together
so we have coffee in the morning we have
lunch and then we have dinner dinner we
usually go out to different places if we
can and so we try and create you know
variety in that way and because we also
don't work on the same things at the end
of the day we catch up and so we go for
a walk for 45 minutes and you know she's
like oh yeah i interviewed this new
candidate i was like oh how'd that go i
was curious how that went so we have all
these novel things that we can talk
about because we're not actually
literally doing everything together it
goes through different phases in the
business you know like in the beginning
of any business we have way more overlap
and that's just because the nature of
the teams are smaller roles are less
defined so we always have more overlap
um but i think what we've gotten way
better at too just kind of like it's a
little tangential is
kind of switching between like you know
co-ceos versus husband and wife
so like how we are and
you know i hope one day we can get
comfortable enough in front of a camera
to be how we actually are um but like
how we are outside of work and outside
of like things that are public facing is
like so much more affectionate and

67
01:06:00.000 --> 01:07:00.000
playful and light-hearted and funny than
it is how we show up at work and so that
was something that we were really
intentional about i want to say about
three and a half years ago is learning
how to switch between those modes
because
you know you're going to be in a heated
discussion and we have a lot of things
we disagree on in the business which is
why we come to good decisions because we
disagree um but then we have to be able
to you know be on a meeting where we
disagree and then get off and then be
husband and wife and not that we have to
but that we prefer to you know because
like we want that aspect of our
relationship as well we like both sides
and so that's been something that we
intentionally worked on kind of like
husband hat you know ceo hat which one
are you wearing
it seems like there's a compatibility
problem that a lot of people in
businesses get to so i've my business
partner for 15 years was the first guy
that i ever sat next to in university my
first ever seminar and 15 years later
we're still business partners and we
have had
it it can only be described as sort of
marital problems like that's the even
though he's married with three kids and

68
01:07:00.000 --> 01:08:00.000
two dogs um
the level of vitriol in some of our
arguments like personal insults the way
that the way that he used to squeeze the
toothpaste tube when we lived together
in edinburgh like 14 years ago anything
i will pull anything that i can out
right i've always been like this and but
the
there is something really unique about
our ability to reset we'll go completely
wild and then five minutes later one of
us will go do you want a coffee and it's
it's done and i don't know what it is i
genuinely believe that it's something
like beyond you can't just think it it's
like a compatibility when it comes to
personality types and the dynamic
between the two of you and the power
play between the two of you that there
is no residual
i i've had i've had arguments that are
10 percent is bad that have lasted for
10 times as long in terms of the after
effect and the lingering resentment and
bitterness and all that sort of stuff
and then there's just people that you
have those with and they just dissipate
these

69
01:08:00.000 --> 01:09:00.000
you go away into the ether so yeah i i
think that um like just straight up
compatibility is probably a big part of
that but the unique thing is that you
guys have to have compatibility squared
it's like not only do we need to be
compatible within the relationship but
also within the business and also within
the relationship between those two
i think if you can do a business
partnership well where money is always
present and other people are always
involved so like you think about the
variables that create problems
and the the number of decisions that you
have to make in a business and agree on
compared to the number of decisions you
have to make in a marital life i think
there are far more high stake decisions
in a business than there are in a
marriage are you saying i should have
married my business partner i think you
might have considered it um
and so i think if you and so i think
that in in many ways i feel like the
marriage has been significantly easier
than that well i don't say the marriage
has been easier than business i think
that the the skills that we learned
being business partners just
directly translated to being married it
honestly is i think it's forced us i
think our our communication as a couple

70
01:09:00.000 --> 01:10:00.000
has gotten so much better so much faster
than i think a lot of people probably
experience because we had the pressure
of the business so we had to learn to
how to in that setting which then
translates over to the personal setting
like it just can't not and so the way
that we give feedback the way that we
encourage each other the way that we you
know
deliver news that we don't want to to
each other i mean it's all just kind of
one
have you talked about kids
we have
that's going to be talked about
yeah yeah yeah awkward if we hadn't
[Laughter]
no we have talked about kids we're we're
right now we're in the in the no kids
camp
um not that we have any belief that it's
wrong or it's bad or it's
like people
i say this for the audience because a
lot of times if people express their
opinions about kids people take it as a
as an attacker and insult on their
choice which is not our thing at all um
at current we have things that we would
like to do that if we had children we
would be precluded from doing and
we don't think that we would give up

71
01:10:00.000 --> 01:11:00.000
those things and
if we had the kids then we wouldn't be
the type of parents that we would want
to be
for them and so given where we're at
right now our age what our goals are it
is not
a priority for us
it's the same reason that i don't have a
dog like i absolutely love dogs i'm not
comparing like toddlers and dogs okay
but i absolutely adore dogs i've been
around them my entire life they give me
more joy than any single other creature
uh
but i watched my mum and dad and the way
that they treated our dogs and the sort
of life that they got the frequency of
walks and attention and food and diet
and
everything and i know that
i'm going to end up resenting the dog
in a little way i'm going to end up
resenting it because it's put a rate
limiter on what i can do with my life
and the only way that i can live the
life that i want to live is if i treat
the dog in a way that would make me feel
completely disgusted with myself so i
there's this like whatever no man's land
in between the two right and you know

72
01:11:00.000 --> 01:12:00.000
people go over to one side or they go
over to the other but uh yeah kids and
dogs that's um so given the fact that
yeah a lot of people
a lot a lot of people sort of especially
couples see their
um
their future investment
as the kids right as the sort of family
after having spent a good bit of time
building up businesses and then
reflecting what does a good life look
like to you now
yeah i mean
it's kind of funny because i think a lot
of times too when people ask us like
well don't you want to have kids because
like what's the vision for your life and
i'm like the vision for our business and
our life are not one in they're not like
separate things so i think we've kind of
intertwined our mission with what we
want our life to look like into our
business and so that's why we're okay
like immersing ourselves in it
completely um you know to us a good life
is to have
challenges that are worthy of our time
right like things that we enjoy uh but
are challenging and hard and
i think that for both of us it doesn't
necessarily mean being comfortable and
happy all the time it means feeling

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fulfilled and like we put in a hard
day's work and so i think for both of us
that's probably what
it looks like to have a good life um and
to be a person of integrity like for
myself
the to to have my thoughts aligned with
my words aligned with my actions is
really important to me and same with
alex and so to just always make sure
that
like i want to have a big impact on the
world if i do not align my thoughts my
words and my actions then i will not
speak that into the world right and so
you have to kind of get your [ __ ]
together in order to put it out there
otherwise i just wouldn't feel right
about it um
and so like in terms of what the life
looks like for us you know we focus much
more on like the impact we want to have
on others not necessarily the gain in
which we will accumulate for ourselves
so like we're not like oh we want this
enormous house with all the stuff in the
woods of montana and this that you know
i think what we've kind of said is we
would like flexibility you know we like
we would like the opportunity right like
what it is i think is we all want
the freedom to have flexibility and so
like if we wanted a big house we could

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have one if we wanted to live in montana
we could but that doesn't mean we want
to i think we both like options and so i
think optionality is probably a big one
for both of us
um
having kids not having kids i don't
think that that would uh that's not like
a necessity in what we want our life to
look like because you know i can make an
argument that we'll have more impact if
we don't have kids because we have more
time allocated to the mission
and if you look at you know tony robbins
talks about the six human needs so
you've got consistency variety uh
growth and contribution and then you've
got uh recognition and
connection right
and so um well it said consistency
instead of sir
what i'm saying um so there's six human
needs right and so most people
oftentimes women will not be as
satisfied in all six of those arenas if
you rank them on one to ten and so
having a child will fulfill those needs
right
the flip side of that is more often men
will have other things are more
satisfied by their work because more of
their needs are met by the work that

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they have right and so within the
dynamic that we you know sit in uh the
business that we're doing right now with
acquisition.com you know if we talk
about uh you know certainty and variety
or consistency and variety we get both
of those through the business talk about
uh growth in terms of us personally
getting better and then also
contribution because the nature that
we've how we built it is you know it's
all about document and sharing the best
practices and then you talk about uh
love and uh you know status or love and
recognition um we get plenty of
recognition you know from the business
for the things that we do and then the
love we have within our marriage and we
also love the work that we do and so in
many ways the business fulfills all of
the needs that we have from a human
perspective and so we don't feel this
hole
uh that that many people do not to say
that it's right or wrong just saying
like we haven't felt this pool
uh to have kids probably as probably as
a result of that yeah and that's
actually something that you know we when
we met with tony robbins it was like a
few weeks ago we went to he was coaching
people in front of us for like eight
hours um that was one of the things i
learned about myself not because i was

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you know i have no problem with the fact
that i don't have a desire to have kids
right now you know a lot of people like
you don't want kids and i'm like i don't
know why but i don't like i just don't
have a desire um and we talked about
we're like why don't we want like i
don't know we don't think about it it's
not like i'm like i'd eating in the
corner like i'm like it literally
doesn't cross my mind when i see them
i'm like
you know um
no and not say like you know plenty of
children are great but you know there's
obviously for every great child there's
a lot that are like whining and crying
and so and there's no lack in any of
those areas so that's why there's no
desire for it
i could see like a world in which we're
like 45 and want a kid you know you got
to be careful that that wall of hormones
can come and hit anybody i've watched
guys as well everybody talks about sort
of women and they get towards their 30s
and blah blah blah i've watched my
friends as well
my dude friends that were the ladies
lads that you can imagine through their
20s and they get into 30s and then maybe
they're in a relationship and then they
just get slammed with this paternal
instinct that they they can't wait for
and they make they make fantastic dads
so i think
the the way that you guys have got it at
the moment which is look this is where
we're at now we know that we're

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01:16:00.000 --> 01:17:00.000
fulfilled on a bunch of different
domains that we think are important for
the time being and remember like this is
the beautiful thing about optionality
right
that it always is flexible in the future
like the the amazing thing about
optionality is the fact that you
permanently have the ability to go in
different directions speaking of um tony
robbins and some of the other big gurus
you've worked with grant cardone and a
lot of people on the internet talk [ __ ]
about him but as people who have worked
with him directly what was your
experience like
so for context um layla bought me a
christmas gift
two years ago which was four one-on-one
calls with grant because it was like
available on the website and she called
and the sales guy didn't even know that
he could sell it and so she had to get
transferred to a manager because he
didn't she was like i'm trying to give
you 130 000 or 100 whatever it was
thousand dollars for four hours and he's
like i'm not sure and the manager was
like i'm so sorry about that i will be
happy to accept your money and so uh
anyways

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uh we've we've done three calls with
grant um
they've been they've been very valuable
i will say that
every experience we've had with grant
has been positive uh he's been attentive
he's taken notes during our calls he's
asked about things that we'd spoken
about the last time um he ways to try
and provide you know contextual feedback
um overall and um overall it was a great
christmas gift for me because like what
do you what do you get someone who can
get themselves you know whatever and for
me the thing that i love more than
anything is just knowledge you know i
mean like everything i did so and
sometimes the knowledge gets rarer and
rarer and harder to uh find right and
especially stories and experiences like
they're the most valuable things because
if i have a story i can get the lessons
from the experience without having to go
through it and so i always think those
are the most valuable things of all and
um but yeah i mean
i think people will hate anyone who's
gonna say what do you think what do you
think it is that causes people to have
this
he's polarizing he's super polarizing i
mean he makes very uh you know strong
claims he talks about money a lot of
people just hate anyone who talks about
money he has money a lot of people hate

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people who have money he shows off the
money that he has which a lot of people
just hate because it makes them feel a
certain way about what you know their
lives um
yeah and i think
polarizing is usually what i think it
means is that people speak in absolutes
yeah so if somebody doesn't believe what
he believes they believe that him saying
that makes them wrong and so then they
immediately say i'll hate you so that
then it basically discredits anything
that you're saying so i feel good about
myself right but i think a lot i mean
you know a lot of people don't have that
self-awareness i mean i get people all
the time and i i think i try to add a
lot of context of like hey there's no
right or wrong they're like [ __ ] you you
know
yeah it's it's strange with nuance right
when people add caveats in
what ends up happening is
they dilute down the impact of the
messaging in the hopes that they're
going to front load a little bit of
criticism
uh defense defense so um
seth godin came on the show and he told
me about he's got one of the biggest
blogs on the planet right he's been
writing daily for

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01:19:00.000 --> 01:20:00.000
15 years or something absolutely wild
and uh he said it was about 10 12 years
ago he removed comments from his blog
this is when medium and and sub stack
and stuff didn't exist and people said
you can't remove comments from your blog
it's a blog a blog has comments and he's
like no i can and i am and the reason
that i am is i know as the audience
grows
every blog post is going to become a
little bit longer with a little bit more
caveats in there with a little bit more
exposition and nuance and a lack of
commitment because i'm always going to
be playing defense ahead of what's going
to appear in the comments below and say
what you want about grant like the guy's
committed to the views that he has you
know and that degree two things happen
with that one is you're right it creates
a delta between what his view is and
what your view is that can't be breached
by you saying oh but he did say
sometimes or i think it's like this and
the other thing that happens with that
is that you cannot
it it causes people to feel

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01:20:00.000 --> 01:21:00.000
uncomfortable seeing somebody that's
that certain about anything because it
shows into very harsh light
i
i don't believe anything that much and
this guy's talking about something which
is
pretty aspirational with that degree of
um confidence that i wish that i had
a good point yeah
oh yeah a lot of people don't like him i
admire him for it so i think a lot of
people don't understand the goal right
like his goal and he's very transparent
is not to be liked his goal is to be
known
and i think that's a very powerful
nuance like he wants to be known
and so if he has he's happy to have more
haters he doesn't care i really like
having spoken to him i mean maybe on
some deep emotional level like it's
there but like i
he has trained himself to love the hate
and he's like you know what haters do
they talk about you more than anyone
else does he's like you know what that
does gets more people in my world he's
like when i he did that stunt where he
pretended like he lost all his money at
the beginning of kovid and like so many

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people hated him he's like look at my
stats bro he's like website's up 200
sales are up 200 he's like look at the
stats man
and so like he it's just it's purely
about what you know does this serve me
and i think grant is very good about
ruthlessly prioritizing like the things
that serve him and cutting out things
that do not and so in that way and this
is just for everyone like
i said at the very beginning but if
someone is making more money than me
they are better at the game than i am in
some way and so
i think just from a fundamental
standpoint of belief about who to look
for or what to look for or where to look
rather
for information
look at people who are ahead of you
ideally far ahead of you and then look
at the delta and say one of these deltas
is if that is what i want one of these
deltas is the right way to do it
and there may not be this particular
tactic but the principle behind it
might be
remember as well that
an absolute genius position to get
yourself into is to have both people who

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01:22:00.000 --> 01:23:00.000
like and dislike your content share it
like that's playing
uh chess right not checkers that that
really is like [ __ ] four-dimensional
hang on a second you're telling me the
people that disagreed with it gave you
extra reach
yeah
um
given the fact that we're talking about
grant cardone as somebody that sort of
liked and not liked him
equal measure
people might look at
your
lives the business that you guys have
built and the position that you've
managed to get yourselves to and it's
you know it's admirable it's one that
probably a lot of different people
will very much want to try and emulate
this is one of the reasons that people
are following you online because they
presume that if they consume your
content
they're going to be able to model
whatever it is that you guys have done
what i'm interested in is the price that
people pay
to get themselves to the level or to be
at the level that other people admire so
what would you say is the price that the
homozy family pays to be the people that

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01:23:00.000 --> 01:24:00.000
people admire
we'll see there's there's i mean i've
talked a lot more about this recently
which is a lot of people are trying to
make content especially like in the
mozination community they see what we're
doing et cetera and um they they're they
aren't able to
they can do the stuff right but they
don't get the heart right which is
they're doing it to serve them rather
than the audience and they're also doing
it from a place of zero expertise and so
they talk about things that they don't
have evidence to support and so what
they'll do is they'll watch a video of
mine or they'll watch a video of grants
or watch it whatever right and then
they'll just pair it back a deluded
version of what they heard right and so
that does not make an expert because
there is no context there is no
experience that backs and supports that
knowledge and so at the end of the day
somebody could take every word that i
say and remake a clone video and the
underlying question will always be why
should i listen to you
and unless the audience has a clear
answer and i think as
unless the speaker has a good answer
it will never go viral even if it even

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01:24:00.000 --> 01:25:00.000
if it's amazing savings and investing
advice if you're a broke teacher
even and you say the same exact thing
that warren buffett does warren
buffett's advice is going to be the one
that's taken his video is going to be
the one that shared why because he's the
one who built berkshire hathaway and so
it's like you did everything right
except for you forgot the one thing that
mattered which was building a 600
billion dollar company except for that
little thing you got everything else
right and so i think it's like they go
for themselves and they don't go to
serve the audience and they speak about
things that they don't have the
authority to speak on and so you know
our shift is to try to get people at
least when the price point is like
instead of if you want to be a business
icon you have to accomplish a pretty
significant amount of business accolades
in order to really be taken seriously
and so it's like don't go abroad you can
still be the absolute best
person who talks about dog training in
austin
and you can be king of that pond and if
you become more successful then you can
talk about dog training in general and
then you can talk about marketing for a
local business and then you can tell you

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know i mean like you can expand outwards
as you gain the recognition the evidence
that support your expertise in the arena
and so the cost or the price that i
think the hormones have paid was that we
are now i'm 32 she's 29 and we are
really now doing the content thing as of
really just the last 12 months um
but i started you know my first i've
been in business 10 years
and so i did you know we did a first 100
million dollar run without any of the
brand
and so there's like that one thing that
people missed like that was the that was
the little price
it's strange when you think as well that
the reverse can happen too
people who give [ __ ] advice but have
tons and tons of credit because they've
been successful in the past can be
listened to totally a hundred percent
absolutely
which is dangerous which is why layla
talks about this a lot but it's i mean
it's hard to do this because people are
not very good at like contextualizing
right uh they're not very good at adding
filters and it's because the reason that

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people seek out experts is because it
actually takes less effort to consume
the information because if you're
talking to somebody who's normal or
potentially a [ __ ]
they will have things that they will say
and you have to take effort and be like
okay let me apply this a little
scenarios does this make sense okay yes
and they say the next thing and you have
to apply a couple scenarios this makes
sense no okay whereas if you listen to
warren buffett and he gives you
investment advice you don't need to
apply a lot of filters because you think
he's the best at this in the entire
world
and so i can just take what he says and
so it becomes less effortful for the
consumer of information because of the
authority that's why people are
persuaded by authority figures so they
don't have to think about it success is
basically a hard to fake signal of
authenticity but it can be weaponized by
people who don't actually know what
they're talking about and then you see
people that's that's kind of what stay
in your own lane should have meant it
got weaponized by people that were using
it in a stupid way but senior and lane
is like look
i'm going to take your advice warren
about finance but i'm not going to let
you give me cues on deadlift form like i
i know where your expertise

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lies look alex and layla hormozy
everybody if people want to keep up to
date with the stuff that you're doing
where should they go
if you search us on whatever platforms
you tend to use we will probably be
there so we're currently on twitter
linkedin instagram we have a podcast
called the game if you guys are
interested in that or i have a podcast
for the game lately starting her soon um
we have a youtube channel if you guys
are into that layla and i both have
separate ones we talk about different
things uh so people get different
different pieces from it leila talks
about her side of the house in terms of
scaling companies scaling the teams
building infrastructure really just
getting end to a thousand um and i talk
about a lot more money stuff so
marketing sales product stuff um how to
increase profits all that kind of jazz i
also have a book it's 99 cents called
100 million offers it's on amazon
link in show notes below guys i
appreciate you thank you what's
happening people thank you very much for
tuning in if you enjoyed that episode
then press here for a selection of the
best clips from the podcast over the
last few weeks and don't forget to
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peace

