https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9If7DixHsc&t=250s&ab_channel=JasonCapital

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why do most of these new agency owners
fail well most of us don't fail
um i'll say some fun stuff yeah yeah i
took a small beta group of ten guys
and uh the average guy made six thousand
dollars the first month
uh i mean nineteen thousand dollars or
second month made thirty four thousand
the third month that's the average
top 20 was already 80 000 by month three
hey what's going on guys jason capital
here and i am
at the uh california temporary home of
one mr alex ramose alex how's it going
good good good good good all right
looking jacked as ever thanks
congratulations on that you know switch
from regular hook to diet change my life
so uh we did an interview like this
about a year ago at your gym and
i actually congratulated texas which was
awesome um feedback on it was insane a
lot of people want to hear
part two a year later so that's just
what we're going to crack into
um so let's let's just get right into it
i
you were just continuing with what we're
talking about you were talking about
um selling stuff selling stuff and yes
chat selling and phone selling and

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where were you going let's just start
that oh man
so over the last i'd say i mean so we've
i've been selling stuff you know
face-to-face i was selling for four
years we did four thousand one one
closes and so like i felt
really good about sales in general and
then transitioning to selling online i
learned a lot of different things about
the
just the difference in selling
environment and i went through tons of
different courses around those types of
sales
and i feel like i've had like you know
when you like swallow tons of
information
like a couple crystallizations that
happen yeah and um
one of them was what i'm just calling
the seven components of a closed deal
and so you know everyone has lists and
whatnot but i think
overall for a large period of time my
belief was that there's only three
objections that can come up on a sale
one is i need decision maker right like
i can't make i don't have authority to
make the decision
the second was um i need to think about
it like a delay close
and then third was price right i was
like you just need to understand those
three
and then you should be able to close
everything right and um that's pretty
much what i preached for

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three and a half well plus the years
that i was selling the gym six seven
years is what i preached
besides the main pitch right and um i
now feel like i've since learned a few
more nuances to it that have helped me a
lot out
when selling clients and so there's four
that are required from the buyer
and three that are required from the
seller so that's what makes the seven
okay
and so the four from the buyer is
something that i learned from the
software world
which they call band which you may be
familiar with i wasn't familiar with the
term but it's budget authority need
timing
okay and what's interesting about this
is that every one of those and so this
came from ibm from the 1960s they
figured out they did this huge
quantitative analysis and they were like
they had so much business coming in the
phones are running off the hook and
they're like how do we just
just know exactly who's a qualified
prospect to pass to a closer
and so they in the in the soft world
especially they separate setters from
closers it's like a very
specific role sdrs and aes typically is
what they call them
and so in order for a prospect to get
qualified that's like a job is to
qualify prospects and then pass them
and bant is the requirement and they

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know that if they do not have one of
those four they cannot close the deal
and so they must have those four to get
passed on
and so in thinking about that it really
affected a lot about how i see friction
in the application process of bringing
prospects in it's like i could
i could front load all of those four
questions onto an application
where i could just collect information
and then put that on a qualification
process with the first call
but at the end of the day those four
questions have to be met from a buyer to
become somebody i can pitch
right on the flip side what the buyer
needs from
us is that they sorry uh is that they
trust us for three different things
and this was what was different from
what i used to believe and so
it's just do they trust that this
product is going to solve their needs in
the way that they want them to be solved
it's not just their needs but just in
because i mean you might want to lose
weight but you might not want to do
surgery
or you might want to lose weight but you
might not want to exercise you might
just want to diet
so it's like will this solve my problem
in the way that i want to have it solved
number one number two do i trust me the
salesperson
because they might believe that but not

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trust you which then influences whether
they're going to buy from you
and then the third is whether they trust
the company whether it's a scam or legit
or it's going to be here
and so what's interesting is that you
can see the differences
in those three pieces on the seller side
in the selling environment and so if
you're selling in person
you automatically have the business
because they walked in you were halfway
there with the salesman as long as you
kind of like
don't [ __ ] it up right and so you really
just need to focus on selling the
product right because they already know
that you're a legit business because
they walked in they know that you're not
going anywhere because you're sitting at
the desk
and so it's just like is this thing
going to help me and so when we
transitioned to phone sales and online
sales
there was way less trust in those
environments and so we had to be
specific about
uh creating that trust in both the
marketing process but also in the
scripting we had around the sales
and so when someone and the reason i
started with the three obstacles that i
thought were presented
is that i now have a different belief
about those which is just that one
every buyer has to qualify for those but
once they're on the call
any of those things that come up are
simply symptoms or smoke screens

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of a lack of trust in me lack of trust
in the business or lack of
trust in that the the product's gonna
solve the problem
and so now we see them as like okay if
they say i need to think about it
it means they're not convinced in the
product and so they're gonna be like
totally understand where you're coming
from and we're gonna talk more about the
product and come back around
and then ask for the sale again and so
if they're like you know what uh i i
need to think about it that's all right
no need to think about it like i have to
talk to my spouse they'll be like i
don't trust you
is what they want to say but they're not
going to say that and so then we're
going to qualify ourselves
not in an arrogant way but just be like
totally understand where we're coming
from i've worked with 300 different gym
owners
who have been in your exact same
situation and were and then we tell them
their own story
right back to them and like and each of
these guys were able to achieve on
average this much
so i totally understand where coming
from but i'm not asking you to make a
lifetime commitment
just you make it just like a soft yes
and so if we make you and then we do a
reasonable close which is
essentially asking a reasonable question
uh to precede the yes
for a close and so this was actually one

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of the biggest things that we've changed
in our entire sales process
was when i used to sell and obviously if
you're good at sales you can sell even
if you don't know what you're doing
right
but i think as you try and repeat sales
in process across teams and across
companies you have to be way more
specific about it
and so um with the reasonableness
i used to be like doesn't that sound
awesome you're ready to start tomorrow
you already start on monday you know
people would be like yeah
yeah yeah but when i have a team i i
want to ask a simple question that's a
lower bar
i don't want to say does it sound
amazing because people like no it
doesn't sound amazing it sounds like a
lot of work
right but i would say something more
reasonable like so if
this does everything that i say it does
or half of what i say it does
do you think the price that i'm that
we're asking for is reasonable and
they're gonna be like yeah that sounds
reasonable
like awesome then let's get you started
and so we we lower the bar of what we're
asking them to say yes to and as soon as
they say yes
like does that sound fair does it sound
reasonable fair enough like all of those
types of closes or recent closes
that we then smooth right into the
actual like cool let's knock out the
paperwork

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and so it lowers the bar and it also in
my opinion makes the clothes
way more logical and so you get a lot
less back outs
and hot like hot buyers or hot sellers
that make sense
yeah so anyways i'm just random about
that but that's
in the top of that that was great so how
is how is that what's been the biggest
difference then in terms of how you
train your sales teams your managers
in terms of like if it's not time or
stall uh decision maker money
yeah what's what's the difference yeah
so um
the way that we do it is we collect info
in our applications just to make sure
that they're the right type of customer
right avatar so the application is more
for the avatar than it is for the band
right we use bant on the uh the the
qualifier so we have one person who
qualifies all the leads
so people book on the calendars but they
get removed from the calendar if they're
not qualified so they have to qualify
themselves
application uh based on messaging
someone saying hey you need to have
these things in order to take the call
so they fill out the application and
then there's a messaging yeah
bans them yes check the boxes exactly
and what's interesting is that when you
say it via conversation it's way less

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uh offensive than if it's on the
application for some reason and so we
just pushed it one step back and it
actually worked way better right
applications
yeah yeah do i have ten thousand dollars
like how dare you yeah exactly peter
asked me this question yeah but like if
someone's like hey by the way this
thing's
uh ten grand like do you have that or
should we just move on to somebody else
and they're like no i i have that right
so after they thought the application
how soon do they get attacked
immediately
is there someone who's just waiting yeah
totally and it just says hey we saw your
application and i want to ask a couple
questions yeah before
exactly we can do phone call we do text
we do whatever they prefer we're pretty
flexible with that stuff okay and then
and then obviously we have the closing
but uh the way that we've changed uh
operationally as a team
is that um i got really frustrated so
this may be for anybody who has a sales
team that you know as an owner
my team was closing 12 percent of first
calls and that was now we were high
enough ticket that it was still fine but
i was still really frustrated with that
and so i hadn't been over sales in two
or three years
i mean like i hadn't directly managed
sales and so um i kind of went back in

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and uh i was like we need to you need
daily reinforcement you need to sharpen
your axe every day if you're gonna top
wood for eight hours
and so we started training daily um and
so i split the tasks into
the component parts of the skills that
are required to be a good salesperson
and so
you know half of sales at least for a
phone sales person or a zoom sales
person is talking and the other half is
listening
and so for half of the the 60 minutes in
the morning they spend
reading the script out loud with the
correct tonality and they read it three
times through
uh without messing up if they mess up
they go to topic right and they
are they doing this with a partner yeah
role play yeah exactly when they
actually meet up they meet up together
they mute themselves they go through
that part and then the second half
they go through uh they go through a
call from the day before
from one of the guys and they either
pick about what they did well or they
didn't do well where they missed
something or a tonality drop and they
didn't attack her there was a belief
pattern that they didn't confront then
blew up in the in the clothes
like things like that yeah um and in the
talking piece they'll also practice
their loops
and so we have three loops that we

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practice one is about trusting me one is
about trusting the product and the other
by trusting the company
and so based on the option they have we
always agree with them be like totally
understand where you're coming from and
then we ignore it
and loop all the way back around and ask
again right and so it's really you can
in theory you could have infinite loops
but usually constrained by time so
usually we can get three or four loops
in
and that is what allows us to now after
we implemented this process in this
um daily cadence for training uh like
last week was 44
first calls right yeah yeah simply by
including improving the skill
right and so what anybody who's in sales
understand that it's not
the words the words are 10 of it like i
could give you chris rock's
entire routine and you could read it and
it would probably bomb yes it's all
about the delivery
right and so um getting them to practice
the proper tonality at the right points
where do i where do i lower my voice so
you think this is more important
right and where do i wherever like
absolutely totally understand where am i
going to say something obvious statement
to embed a belief
of something that's really positive but
i'm going to say it so it's obvious and
a preconceived
like notion that you should obviously
know yeah right yeah and so where where

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am i going to use these different
tonalities of different parts of the
script
so that i can be more persuasive yeah
and so um
we layered those pieces in to our own
scripting and how we drilled
and then this is just a practice so
every morning the sales team gets up
i can show you my phone i have up up up
up up at four o'clock and five o'clock
in the morning when they all wake up
together
and they practice first thing before
they you know think about their wives
before they think about their kids they
practice for an hour
and i think part of that's also setting
the intention for the day of like i'm a
closer
i'm here to i'm here to close i'm here
to make sales and i'm not here to take
orders i'm here to order people
you know um and so by doing that that's
what's created a culture of high
performance
and so when we get a new sales guy who
comes on if they're in that lion's den
like they will not if they're like you
guys wake up at four it's like
yeah matter of fact yeah yeah like you
don't
um you're going to practice it's just
like you're practicing with us and if
you're not going to then there's really
no point in you being here yeah because
there's no way you're going to beat us
yeah because just like kobe like they're
doing an hour every day of deliberate

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practice six days a week our guys train
six they only have to do five they still
meet on saturday mornings and train
yeah and that's just the culture and
that's that's the that's the special
sauce
that gets the extra oomph that happens
that um
is harder to replicate but the training
process itself
can be replicated by anyone and we'll
typically you know 2x
your sales just from that one three and
a half yeah that was that was
process plus culture yeah you know so
yeah that's awesome totally sell stuff
yeah were you
were they doing training like that
before no they weren't there was no
what what did the training look like
before before it was probably standard
it was two weeks of
uh they'd go through you know training
the course they would role play
you know with with some of the sales
guys that were established and they
would do ride-alongs
for a little bit and they'd listen to
usually about 20 different sales calls
recordings and then at that point we put
them on
and then yeah in seven days if they're
not closing then you'll find out
right they're not they reveal yeah got
it exactly so
have you found a way to transfer some of
this culture and training
cadences into your training your chat

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everything yes so
what are they doing yeah and so what are
the component parts of somebody who does
chat they have to read and they have to
be able to
type yeah and so what they do is we our
guys train on typing speed every morning
because i can increase their throughput
typically by double so if i can get you
to do twice so many chat today you can
sell twice as many people per day
right and so we train on on on typing
and so they actually go through and the
nice thing is there's tons of
really established wells or software oh
yeah tons and they're free
um but the one that we have is super
cheap and i can see everyone's and i
think
i see their logs i can see their speed
improved i can see what time they're
logging all that stuff
yeah and then on flip side is reading
comprehension and there's tons of
programs online to help people read
and comprehend information faster and so
if i can improve and what i like about
this as a business owner is that i feel
like i'm actually like really improving
and investing in
our employees because anybody who can
read and type faster is a more valuable
human
yes fundamentally totally right and to
the same degree somebody can listen and
detect language patterns and tonality
shifts will be a more persuasive
individual which will help them in their
life
overall totally and so um i'm trying to

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break down
all of the departments that we have into
the component skills that are required
and create daily trainings for each of
them right now i'm done three
departments
um but we're just continuing to move
down because of the huge increase in
throughput that we had
for the sales team i was like and it's
it's more prevalent for repeated action
departments
so department like customer service
department that would do typically they
you know they confront the same problems
every day and so it's like this is
repeated action
what are the skills that are required
how can we break them into component
parts and then how can we practice them
um and then what is the you know primary
kpi for that department so that they can
always see that that thing's moving in
the right direction
is it uh time of resolution if it's if
it's if it's a
customer service rep if it's chat it's
you know how cool can we get someone
scheduled
uh if it's a sales person what's their
their percentage of first calls closed
whatever those you know stats are yeah
so in the um
the typing training which training the
typing training yeah the agents
is that is it are you having to just
type whatever the software
does for practices or yeah okay no it's
just whatever the they might have them
type whatever it is yeah okay it's not

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related to actual scripts no
okay no no no um it's actually yeah it's
it's very straightforward because we're
not we're not selling anything uh we're
just we're doing six inch putts we're
just getting
people over the edge where they just
people just need to be followed up with
and so
it takes way less ingenuity and way more
uh just effort yeah you know i mean
there's no like
there's not a short it's just yeah it's
just effort yeah there's not there's not
nearly as much
uh nuance there is don't get me wrong i
don't want to anybody on my team who's
listening like it's not like it's
it's easy but compared to somebody who's
closing there's way more nuance than i'm
sure
okay um so i wanna shift gears real
quick and uh i wanna talk about a little
bit about onboarding and choreography
all right cool yeah you see i got a
checklist here yeah
i'm going to get what i want for all
right um
so obviously in engine launch you guys
have helped an enormous amount of gems
in a very short amount of time like
transform lives and children and family
like really made an impact with that
and um you were able to extract results
from people who
previous people that paid could not

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extract those results from um
and i think a big part of it is i think
you've said to me in the past where you
like
forced success out of people where they
don't have a choice right so
can you just walk me through like how
did it look at the very beginning the
onboarding
and then what were the big distinctions
or changes you guys made for success out
of people and get some
success stories so um i think there's a
lot of different components but i'll try
and
break down the fewest ones so big the
first one is price
like price alone will get the more
someone pays the more they'll pay
attention the more invested they are the
more invested they'll be
and so simply charging more for your
services will automatically get you a
higher quality customers who are more
likely to
implement and b they're more likely to
because of their investment so it's kind
of both sides of it it's like you have a
higher quality individual
and you have a higher more higher
investment from that individual
so both of those things together can
create an environment that's more likely
for someone to succeed
so that's like piece number one very
straightforward
number two is the mousetrap that we're
trying to build and trying to teach them
and so
that's you know if i had a program like
it'd be so easy for me to sell

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like how to make money online for
example but i would know that
if i just wanted to make it as a general
theory course then i would know that
automatically you know one out of 20
would be able to have all of the
requisite skills and personality and
beliefs
to accomplish it and so i can't do that
or i can't sleep with that i want to try
and figure out ways that i can get 80 or
90
of people to be successful and so what
that means is i sacrifice sometimes
teaching people how to have 100 million
dollar business so that i can teach
everyone how to have a one million
dollar business
and i made that decision and elon musk
actually was
quoted about this he's like i'd rather i
could either help a small amount of
people
a lot or help a lot of people a little
he's like i'd rather help a lot of
people a little bit
and so that's kind of where i think
about this is like rather than have 10
people who i take 200 million i'd rather
have
you know a thousand people i take to one
million even though it's the same total
overall i feel like that makes far more
impact and so um when we build the mouse
traps themselves
we're we're looking for we always based
on averages and medians
it's not like do we have testimonials
i've testimonies from every single test

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we ever run
but that doesn't mean it's effective
because one guy is a stud and can close
five thousand dollar sales over the
phone doesn't mean everyone is
and so when we're thinking about the
offers the price points the down cells
the upsells the choreography for their
clients
to go through their mousetrap i think
and test each of those pieces and so
for example the online gym model that we
recently had to pivot all of our gyms
over to
there's there's four component parts
to the business and then each of those
parts has had at least five different
iterations that we've tested
and so if you're looking at that you've
got 20 different tests that we had to
run
uh with small five to 10 gym beta groups
and then we'd measure the results and
see if it was above or below
the average prior and if it was above we
implemented it and if it was below then
we just disregarded it
and so that came with the offers that
came with the price point for the first
sale that came with the price point and
the selling process for the second sale
and the same for the third sale
uh walking them through that and so
that's again so first is the price
second is the mouse mousetrap that
they're actually implementing is it
built for
mass success or is it built for
individual high achievers

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which is a big difference right and then
third
um is focusing on because you talked
about onboarding
is focusing on activations that have
turn and so i got this again from the
software world which is why software's
been really good for me as an
entrepreneur i've learned a lot
um but the software world is all about
activation and not churn churn is a
lagging indicator it's like you're
looking at your turn to try to make it
go down
it's really difficult to do that because
it takes usually two or three months for
any
thing that you do to show an effect
which means that if you're actually
testing something
uh in theory you only have four tests a
year you can run because if it takes
three months to actually test and see if
it improved then you can only do one
implementation wait three months one
implementation wait three months
and so you if you're in a competitive
space you can't only change four things
a year
and so it's way easier to look for a
leading indicator like activation
to figure out or reverse engineer a
client that's going to stay
and so the process of looking through
that is what are our best clients
and taking all of those cutting everyone
else out and then seeing
and then basically turning back the
clock and seeing
what are the what are the attributes of

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these clients right and that affects the
application questions
that i'm screening for them specifically
and then
um from there what are their what are
their other component parts did they
have employees how many of them they had
do they have multiple locations what
type of gyms were they
uh what geographic locations were they
had all of those things are going to
factor into
you know whether someone was successful
or not and so if we can
get that client avatar right and then we
also know that they attended each of
their calls
on time and we know that they launched
within their first seven days and we
know that they made their first 2000
2000 sale within the first 14 days then
we're gonna try and reverse that and
then try and incentivize those actions
so um either through carrot or stick so
if someone signs on with us and we say
cool you have four onboarding calls that
you have to attend and if you don't
we're gonna bill you 500
for recall you miss then someone's
really really motivated to make sure
they attend those calls
and so then i can reverse engineer the
activation
sequences that someone said about the
activation points right exactly is that
what you did
did you actually do the 500. so we uh we

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are big on penalty fees
in general um but yeah they know that
they have other things that they don't
get access to we also hold
like information a hostage uh it's
another way of doing it that's not as
aggressive so it's like you don't want
to access the information so you attend
these things
and so then it's like things like that
that are easier to implement
to get people to stay but we use the
penalties in the fitness business
so for those clients they have three
calls they have to attend their
supplement sale
the continuity sale and the second
continuity sale and so once they sold a
trial
they're sold on the fact that they have
to go to these things or they will get
billed
and so with that then we make sure that
they show up for the sales appointments
which we know are going to be conversion
so on the on the uh ascension sale call
whatever it is whether it's for fitness
business your businesses or whatever
that call also has an incentive around
it that they have to attend yeah for the
fitness businesses for ours
it's a different incentive it's just
more like you're not going to get the
thing right
and what is what is the framing on that
call
i don't think we have too much of a
frame it's like this is just how we do
it like a checking call yeah this
is you mean for so because we're a

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performance business which is kind of
interesting
um we there are
there's only one way for us to make a
customer more valuable for us which is
just get them to
basically make more money and so the way
to do that
is we have to increase their
availability so to increase the amount
of times they can take sales calls
increase their ad spend so we can get
the more people in the door
and then ultimately increase their close
ratio which is kind of indirect
to whether they're going to be
successful and stay right and so
um all of the efforts that we have are
trying to not
upsell but try and get people to like we
try to get you to make more money so
that we can make more money right
and basically increasing the amount of
throughput that we can drive through
their facility
whether it be online or in person so
that they can make more money and taken
away
how big of a role do you think um
reverse engineering those activation
points and then
aligning incentives so they happen in
the way that you want
plays on how many people send to the
second thing that they're doing
uh based on the research layla quoted
this so it's not me
um most people make the decision whether

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they want to stay with your company
between the sale and the first call
that they have so like not even when
they've tried your product just through
their experience between
when they were sold and what their first
real touch point is with the company how
they've been treated during that period
of time
they've made their decision of whether
or not they want to stay with you yeah
and then they'll stay consistent yeah
and so either you're playing catch up
right and you're
screwed and you're going uphill or you
already have
some trust and some good on your side
that you can continue to bank on what
are
what are some of your favorite things to
do between sale and first of all um
we send handwritten cards we send stuff
to animals
we make sure that everything is always
documented everything that's verbal is
also documented in writing
so it's like i'm going to tell you right
now what's going to happen next you're
also going to get an email after this
call that says everything that i'm
saying right now if you have questions
reference the email you're also going to
need a recording of this call that's
also going to send an email so if you
need to watch this again or show it to
your team
right and so the next call is on tuesday
that's the third that's in three days
from now
right and so on there you're gonna need
these three things between now and then
if you don't give me those three things
i can't give you access to this thing
cool great so please send me back those

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things or i won't be able to do this
call with you you know what i mean yeah
that's
it's really being it's really just
clarity it's just communication
it's conviction and it's clarity it also
makes me feel safe yeah right
because people just want to know how to
have anxiety about aftermath i don't
remember that [ __ ] now you got it i
didn't trust you
yeah i think a lot of people i think
about the old dan kennedy quote about
their umbilical cord the kingdom plug-in
and um
i think a lot of people are just looking
to abdicate everything and if they meet
someone who's just gonna i'll do
everything for you and
you just hear that kind of thing i think
it makes an enormous difference um
okay so all right i have a couple
questions for my team let me go to these
right now
they look at it i had them slapped me i
was like because just so you got zach
and wally specifically i know that you
guys
love alex and his podcast so um
so zach had a question you mentioned in
a podcast at some point
um but i hated interviewing someone's
like you once said this
um but you said in a podcast he said
about uh a
focus coach an attention yeah what is
there is that a real thing
what was yeah it was a real thing um

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yeah so basically i spent 90 minutes
every day talking to the same coach and
he would just be like what's on your
mind
and so it basically would just clear
things or just clear items and so if it
was like
this is something i'm concerned about or
this thing with my mom came up or it's
just like i had so much
you know he called him confusions but
basically things that were just draining
my attention
and so clearing those things is really
just a function of
understanding what they are and so a lot
of times we have these
misunderstoods these things that have
happened in our past that we don't
understand them and so they block
up they hold attention basically and
then once you can release those
you get the attention back and so
there's just a deliberate process of
thinking like kind of like auditing
yourself and thinking like okay what are
the things that are on my mind right now
what are the things that are taking my
attention
and then what are those things can i
clear right what what what loops
that are open can i close yeah um
and that can be relationships with
friends it can be relationships with you
know
co-workers it can be something someone
said it can be something that you felt
as a response to something you saw
it could be any of those things um but

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one of the biggest ones is understanding
what it is about it that bothers you
and then many times it's because you
don't even understand
what it is and then it's really just
doing that work and diving into it until
you kind of like shed light on it and
you're like okay now i understand this
it no longer bothers me
i have my attention back and so that was
just a deliberate process that i ran
through for
for nine months every day every day five
days a week yeah for 90 minutes
um when was this this was
2017. that's when you were launching
yeah yeah a lot of things happened
during that period of time
so i was just like i was just all in on
everything you know what i mean where
it's just like
i didn't went all in on that i stopped
drinking i you know
married layla i was just like this is
where i'm going you know what i mean so
it was just like you're like do you
think that's the one thing
i think everything was the one thing
like i think it was what was the one
thing that changed no idea
um but it was just i was really tired
of what i was doing and really
needed a different way of living and so

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that's what i
did and since that ended do you carry
out that kind of practice
yourself so layla and i will talk more
uh with each other of like
what's taking your attention you know i
mean that's usually the phrase that
we'll use
um but i think that the the
more frequently you practice it the more
the faster you are detecting those
things
and you stay clear if that makes sense
rather than
because like you'll feel weighted and
you're like what's on like what's going
on but if you don't know how to detect
that
the world just feels heavy yeah and it's
just like everything feels overwhelming
yeah when it's really not even a really
huge task
right and the the easiest way i can
describe that from a mental standpoint
is if you've ever like had a math
problem that you were looking at you're
like i can't solve this thing and then
you go to sleep and you wake up and
you're like
why was i struggling with this this is
not hard or you might have had a work
thing whatever
that's the easiest description of what
it feels like to get attention back
in my opinion and so all of a sudden
these problems that used to be complex
or
are really difficult to understand seem
really easy to see the component parts

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and be like i understand each of these
pieces
but if you don't have the horsepower
because you're so distracted from all
these other things in your life
you become really impotent as a person
you just have very low capacity as an
individual and you can't accomplish much
even if even if you have a
ferrari engine um it's being weighted
down with all this other stuff that it's
you know it's running the ac it's
running that you know whatever the you
know analogy
yeah exactly yeah how did you find that
coach
um how did i find that coach i was
recommended to him by an ex-business
partner
he's like hey you suck you're paying
attention yeah yeah
it's actually more or less what it was
he was just like you are way too
distracted
were you were you from your own
assessment do you feel like you were
like a very different person before that
process
totally you were mm-hmm yeah yeah i mean
the same person but just
uh your attention scattered yeah yeah
you know i mean scattered and
overwhelmed would you say most people
are
scattered today totally yeah most people
walk around just unsure
and consistently reactive they're just

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00:29:00.000 --> 00:30:00.000
reactive
they just have emotions and they just
feel them and they don't know what to do
brother being able to like see them
interpret them and process them and be
like
okay you know and it just takes time and
it's i think it's just a deliberate
practice right
it's like a muscle you're exactly you're
driving muscles though
i'm all about the game man next question
he said how do you um
what do you like to do to train sales
managers and support them best so
we're actually in an interesting spot
right now in our company we have the
best sales team we've ever had and i've
had probably six high performance teams
that i've
run myself over the last you know seven
years
and the team that we have now is the
best team and i if the last team i had i
wouldn't have said that was the best
team if it had been that moment it
wasn't
um i knew we had some issues um but this
team
is amazing because of the culture and so
currently i have one manager he's a
director who runs both marketing and
sales which is i've never done before
but there's some really cool advantages
to that because
he owns acquisition and so typically
when you have marketing and sales
sales complains that the lead quality

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isn't high enough or there's not enough
of them and marketing
says sales can't close anything and so
it's just this constant battle but when
you have one guy who's responsible
then he's looking at both sides of the
equation and trying to calibrate it so
that we can just get the most money
right right
and so um holding one person accountable
to that has been really huge for me
beyond that we have basically what i
would consider a sales lead so it's kind
of like the spirit leader of the sales
team
and he's the one who really enforces the
daily training but
but if the culture is right the whole
team is bought in which our current team
is and so we now just hired a new person
this
uh last week who just started and he's
diving heads first and they're just like
this is how we roll like either run with
us or don't but like we're [ __ ] going
yeah
and so um in terms of uh
the the processes one is just installing
the daily training second is just having
a weekly cadence with them to understand
what the
what's coming up um and we do that with
marketing and sales
together because right exactly because
if we're detecting because the sales
should be the front line to give
feedback to marketing
and if they're both on the same team

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then it's not this animosity it's more
like
hey guys we're getting a lot of personal
trainers on the phone and
they're not qualified they're like okay
let's see if we can adjust the targeting
or maybe we can adjust the application
or just the headlines
to try and address that um and so just
it just works it works both ways and it
works a lot better okay
i don't know if that was the answer
you're looking for no i mean what is the
what's the
cadence i guess of communications
between you and the sales manager oh
once a week
yeah once a week yeah but once a week
with the team and once and once a week
one-on-one
and when you talk to your manager like
what's your mindset what are you looking
for um
this one guy manages both marketing and
sales and so it really depends on what
if i'm being honest with you is depends
on what the
what the bottleneck is so if the
bottleneck right now is marketing then
we're gonna be talking about messaging
hooks and
you know what what are the main
directions we need to take for the ads
that are coming out
if it's if the the bottleneck
is on sales then it's gonna be how do we
onboard more sales people how do we draw

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them where do we get some more people so
it's really
it just depends on what is the problem
that we're dealing with yeah and that's
what we address
so something i've i've personally
struggled with a little bit is trying to
figure out do i solve the problem
or do i try and empower the person and
let them solve it what do you
what's your question really interesting
so there are
i think four or five i can't remember
where it is um big beliefs that i've
had broken uh that i feel like i
routinely break for people who are
trying to get to eight figures or
multiple eight figures and so
this is an inverse this is an unrelated
answer to your question in a roundabout
way
one of them is to spend more on
marketing
period like when we look at our this
might be crazy for you so i looked at
our total lifetime spent on marketing
and our total
uh dollars made and we have a 35 to one
return on our ad spend
lifetime so we spent 2.6 million dollars
we've done 91.92 million dollars in
sales
off two and a half million dollars of ad
spend and
i should just spend more money that's
what i should do if you look at that and
you're watching
that more than two right yeah of course

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but when i talk to people who are
smaller in their businesses they're
afraid to spend money and so sometimes
it's just a belief it's like dude you're
spending 500 a day spent 5 000 a day
like what's the point like what's the
what's the bottleneck here it's just
getting people to make that first step
is one of them
the second one is increasing their price
right you need to charge more otherwise
there's no profit and i go through lots
of explanations about that
the third one because i'm going to get
to the why i'm talking about this
um is paying for talent
um and understanding that the
best people need to get paid like the
best people and so thinkers need to pay
to be paid
much more than you expect and doers need
to get paid less
and so there's actually more of a
dichotomy between those two things
because a thinker should be able to make
the decision for you
and make the right call and in in theory
you should be able to make a better call
than you
and so i don't know if you've ever like
gone to a company and met an employee
and been like
man this employee's freaking awesome
like man if i hit this person on my team
and the goal for us is to how can we
create that experience for every one of

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00:34:00.000 --> 00:35:00.000
our
employees right um and typically high
performers are not you know
and no offense anybody on my team but
people who you know are not at 50 or 60
or 70 000 a year like a lot of times
high performers are 150 250 250 plus
bonuses like
that type of person has confidence knows
how to make decisions has a track record
and they're not coming for peanuts
and i think the mistake that i've made
um was that i tried to
turn a camry into a cadillac you know i
mean it's trying to trying to push
someone and empower someone who does not
have the skills or does not have the
bandwidth or doesn't have the attention
because of other [ __ ] that they're
dealing with in their lives to actually
make good decisions
and so the delegation is one piece of it
but it's still getting to a team member
that's capable if the person isn't
capable you shouldn't delegate it
because they'll make a horrible decision
but it's finding the right people and
then building superstar teams and i know
that sounds really trite but like until
i internalized that and made that like
my truth
then like the world opens up because you
know i don't do a tremendous amount in
my company

36
00:35:00.000 --> 00:36:00.000
because the people that run those
departments are better at it
like suzanne is rcfo and she's way
better at finance than i am like
megan knows all the the the hr jessica
knows all the hr stuff and
like just all the people in our company
just know their divisions way better
than i do
i actually make sure the strategy's
right and then like the numbers make
sense but
um but it took time like we replaced so
i went through this experience i had 11
directors
i have now replaced all 11 over the last
18 months
with new directors that are at that next
level because directors we had were me
putting
um this is no this is not a direct
insult or anything like that to
my former directors but it was putting
lipstick on a pig it was trying to put
you know rockets on on a two-seater it
didn't it didn't make sense it was they
were at their
point of incompetence and they had
gotten us to here
they weren't going to get us to the next
level yeah and so that's the mistake
that i make and that i see a lot of
entrepreneurs make it they're not
willing to pay
for talent even though i have tons of
margin in their business um
and so hopefully that wraps around the

37
00:36:00.000 --> 00:37:00.000
answer so so i mean
basically if you're paying someone 150
250 plus bonuses or something
you expect them to be a cadillac to be a
ferrari and to solve the [ __ ] problem
right yeah and you should have a track
so one of my i made this podcast it was
lessons from 2019. it's like 30 minutes
long of literally every lesson that i
learned of all my [ __ ] ups
and one of them was that higher for uh
high for traffic and not potential and
so i used to hire for culture fit and
potential i'm like this guy could be
amazing it's like now i don't give a
[ __ ]
it's like [ __ ] potential like what have
you done like i don't want to know
someone who knows how to run an olympic
gold i want somebody who already has the
medal
yeah because there's a lot of things you
learn along the way that you don't know
that you're going to learn right and so
i want somebody
like i feel like i'm buying someone's
experience at a discount
compared to the cost of the mistakes i
would make if i didn't have them and so
it's worth paying a premium
to pay down my ignorance tax on what i
don't know that's going to happen
that they should know yeah do you uh
did you think anytime no you mentioned
ignorance
no i should but but you i think all the

38
00:37:00.000 --> 00:38:00.000
time and at the same time
like of all the entrepreneurs that i
know you are probably the most
self-aware
um well you're you're very aware of
strengths and weaknesses and they're
open with admitting both
um whereas most entrepreneurs it takes
them like three months to admit a
mistake and you get one in three days
and you pivot immediately
what do you think plays into that
self-awareness uh
i don't know crippling insecurity
probably that's the secret yeah well
there's uh
i saw this study that sam evans posted
um that i it's basically had
there's three components of
hyper-successful people um
one is uh sense of superiority that
they're better than everyone
sorry the other is um incredible
insecurity feeling that they're never
gonna be good enough
and then self impulse control
that's it that makes a lot of yeah and
it's and i think it's the more maxed out
all those are
the more you feel like you're better
than everyone the more you feel like
you'll never be good enough and the
harder you can control your impulses
those three things are what amplify the

39
00:38:00.000 --> 00:39:00.000
individual and it's not
and none of those things are iq you know
that means sorry but
um so why you know why do i admit it's
just like i think it's just whatever's
necessary for for winning
but when you say i sit and i think a lot
like what does that look like
so you know layla and i walk um probably
three times a day
and so i'm a talking thinker and so
for me that that manifests i don't do a
lot of
solo thinking time i do a lot of talking
a lot of time so i'm like i wonder if we
and that's like you know what i mean and
i start bouncing for a while and
sometimes i feel bad because my like
teammates or my employees will be like i
feel like you just talked at me for 30
minutes and i'm like
yes but i feel like we made progress and
so
that's that's actually what thinking
looks like for me is i'll have kind of
one-off conversations about like
something like i need to i need to
put some mass to this yeah i need to
bounce this off of you
um and that's usually how a lot of the
the big thoughts get moved forward in
the company
but as we've evolved as a company um one
of the big things that i've

40
00:39:00.000 --> 00:40:00.000
like at the cr at my current
entrepreneurial place
um the big three for making decisions
has been probably the big i think i
might have shared it with you
um it was from keith henry himself less
stupid
really good book it's what's my upside
of making this call because usually as
entrepreneurs we're weighing out
decisions costs and benefits right
should i make this
change this price should i whatever we
make a million decisions like this
what's my upside what's my downside and
the third one
let me assume the downside and can i
live with it
and i think that for a really long time
i just looked at upside down side
and just said well if i have a so jeff
bezos was
one of my favorite quotes is um if you
have a 10
chance of getting a hundred times payout
you should take that bet every time
knowing that 99 times would be wrong
but what if the minimum bet at the
casino
is uh 10 and you have 30 bucks should
you still take the bat
right and you getting down to zero means

41
00:40:00.000 --> 00:41:00.000
that it's going to take you x amount of
time
to bounce back and i feel like that's a
far more uh
nuanced question and i think that that's
far more the reality and so i read that
first quote and i made a lot of
decisions in the first two or three
years of business that if i could make
them again now i wouldn't have made
because whenever you make any change
there's always you always incur the cost
of change
and so i think i changed a lot of things
in my company from happy to glad um
so it's like you change the word from
happy in a paragraph to glad and it's
the same thing
and so there was really no substantive
change that happened but we did still
incur the cost of change
and so i got the cost of change but i
didn't get the benefit and so
and sometimes just things being new and
exciting gives you minor pops then it
goes back to maintenance right
and so i would be far more sparing and
deliberate with the choices that i would
make and i feel like i am now
in terms of changing direction uh with
the company i mean i still need to work
on it
but that's where my kind of deliberate
practice that i'm working on for me as
an entrepreneur right now is doing
less and doing more at the same time so
making fewer changes and doing more
repeating successful actions

42
00:41:00.000 --> 00:42:00.000
like okay well if we're spending this
much spend more if we have three sales
guys get six if we have you know what i
mean it's
just expanding instead of changing yeah
and i think one of the mistakes that
a lot of earlier entrepreneurs myself
included make is that we want to
put jetpacks on a two-seater and figure
out
how to get more out of this thing rather
than just admitting the fact
that you just need a bigger [ __ ] car
yeah right and that's it like you still
need to drive the same way
you just need a bigger car and so it
just means sometimes you just have to
get more sales guys you just have to
spend more money you don't need to
change your business model to make more
money you just need to do more of what
you're already doing yeah
yeah it reminds me a lot of uh i've
heard warren buffett's analogy about
the punch card in investments yes the 20
is yes 20 decisions
yes yeah it's totally like that yeah
it's totally like that but with your
business just like strategy
yeah especially as entrepreneurs i mean
you're talking about impulse control
we're all with this idea
this idea but it drives your team crazy
and they're getting positive complexity
and change which
is guaranteed but the reward of the
change is not getting right and is the

43
00:42:00.000 --> 00:43:00.000
is the cost worth the reward right right
because the cost is
assumed and then you have the real cost
which there's cost of chain is assumed
and then you have the true downside
which is like well what if it goes down
can i live with that um because i've
definitely made some bets where i'm like
the downside was pretty high and if i
had thought
this is going to happen can i live with
that i would not have said yes
and it's nice things that you can apply
it anywhere so like i'll give you a
really real world example
it's stupid but it's small so leila and
i were working out on vacation
and she brought her trx thing it was a
hotel gym
and so they actually had a trx hook and
i was like oh that's convenient so i
hooked it there it was kind of pain in
the ass i said like get on and like put
stools together goes all the way up and
i hooked it and right as we were leaving
you know after working out i was like
uh do i want to take this with me or not
like because like no one was at the gym
like it was totally one of those like no
one's ever gonna see it
yeah and so i'm looking at this thing
like it's gonna be painting us to get
that back up
get that down and then do it again
tomorrow and the next day the next day
and so i was like well what's the upside
the upside is that i save time and
effort from doing that my downside

44
00:43:00.000 --> 00:44:00.000
is someone steals it and i can't use it
for the rest of the workout and someone
stole it
can i live with the downside no okay
then i have to go get it it's just like
but like that was like literally
applying
yeah and i don't know if i necessarily
if i didn't have that i probably would
have been like
[ __ ] i'll leave it that's so sure um
but sometimes applying this it's like i
can't live with the downside i'll be
really annoyed with that
and the downside is not worth it and so
it wasn't worth the upside and so it's
just applying that framework for a lot
of decisions
and so when you're making uh when you
are making a choice that this is a
change this is something we're going to
implement here yeah
a new test whatever it might be uh one
thing i've struggled with is
i'm like oh this is good this is let's
focus on this and yeah and uh this is
the bottom line for ways to stop
is i implement it with team leaders and
things like that
and then i get sucked into the whirlwind
of everything else that goes on in the
business and i find myself
forgetting to push it through or
whatever yeah all right
how do you avoid like the whirlwind and
i think
i think it's a function of how good the
people are really it's kind of like that

45
00:44:00.000 --> 00:45:00.000
that third belief of just like if you
had like if i say
hey suzanne i need you to implement this
new thing with finance
i have no idea even how to do it so i
won't even be helpful
right i think where entrepreneurs
struggle the most is where they have
expertise
so it's harder for me to stay out of
marketing that is for me to stay out of
finance
and so um i think layers of layers and
degrees of separation is the only thing
that i've seen and i'm
beyond as i struggle with it especially
with marketing because it's kind of like
what i'm what i feel like i'm good at
um and so the layers that have to be
there is like
layla is a layer of protection against
me because she and the thing is is that
layla
is amazing because she's she's an expert
at operations and leadership
and culture but she's not a domain
expert of any of the individual skills
and so because of that she does really
good job delegating because she doesn't
have the desire
or what she perceives to be this skill
set to do this thing better than the
person he can
and so she never gets sucked in and so
she's able to take something from me
become the air filter and then make sure

46
00:45:00.000 --> 00:46:00.000
that it gets executed
and that's been the single most
effective thing that i've done
and so that's like the whole first
follower theory integrator and um
uh what's the traction one it's
visionary yeah visionary and integrator
it's just really making sure that that
number two in your company like when you
talk about thinkers
like when you're starting and you're
going from like zero to a million or
three million you really have like a
manager right when you go
three two to a million a month you have
like a director
but once you get like a million a month
plus it's really about somebody who can
really lead operations and people
it's about leadership and so i think
that that that role goes from manager to
director to
really like a co leadership type like a
c-level executive
at that point and that person may be the
person who could make all three of those
changes but
it's very rare right because there's
three jumps that happen in every
individual's life you have individual
contributor
you have manager and you have leader and
it's very rare that you can have
all three of those jumps most people can
make one maybe a lot of people can't
even make one like you're sure you've

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seen star salespeople great individual
contributors can't manage
and plenty of managers really detailing
so you can follow kpis but can't lead
and so those are the pivots that i think
that you make at least from the one to
three three to ten
um sorry millionaire yeah uh jumps that
the the person has to change and
typically it doesn't mean that those
individuals and the managers don't exist
it just means another layer has to get
added which is how corporate
infrastructure becomes corporate
infrastructure yeah and then
entrepreneurs like i don't want to build
this i did
i left corporate america it's like well
the reason corporate america looks like
america is because that's how you make a
ton of money right
okay right like show me one corporate
america you know company
that's that size that has a flat
infrastructure
doesn't exist right and like the
entrepreneur owns that company
didn't want that it just became a
requirement for achieving
the end goal this is what it is you get
sued enough times and eventually you
have policies that are a pain in the ass
you know i mean you have hr that has to
deal with stuff because of the legal
system and that's just an eventuality of
how all businesses that get big enough
have to deal with yep
so uh as we kind of uh park this car

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00:47:00.000 --> 00:48:00.000
and head in here i you have uh
you've helped um a lot of agencies
recently yeah right a lot of people
uh even in my audience either started a
social media marketing agency or one way
too in the last several years
uh most of them fail obviously we know
that
um why why do most of these new agency
owners
fail um well most of ours don't fail
um i'll tell you some fun stuff yeah
yeah i can tell you fun stats if you
want them um
so well one okay so i'll tell you i took
a small beta group of ten guys
and uh the average guy made six thousand
dollars the first month
uh i mean nineteen thousand dollars or
second month made thirty four thousand
their third month that's the average
top twenty percent was already eighty
thousand by month three uh per month
pretty cool right
and so um the the big issues that most
agency
sma whatever um have is that they're
just hey they're just not good
so that's the that's the big one you're
just actually not that good which is why

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you don't deserve to make more money and
when you say not great you mean at the
actual fulfillment part
yeah like they don't know and they're
probably not that good at marketing
which is why they can't get customers so
it's like
right you know it's a really interesting
thing of like you're not good enough to
do marketing to get customers for your
business how are you good enough through
marketing for the business that you want
to get yeah
totally yeah so uh
the biggest one is that they don't take
enough uh accountability for the client
results
so you know getting leads on a lead
sheet is not is not
it's not exciting it's not valuable
right and so they don't
use their business acumen to try and
improve the acquisition process for the
small business which is typically what
most of them are marketing for small
business owners
and so they don't think how can i get
someone to make more money in their
first 30 days because if they can make
more money in the first 30 days they can
spend more money to require a customer
they can also spend more money on me
right and so most of them price
themselves out of the market and by that
i mean they're trying to undercut so
they're at 500
000 a month which is basically
impossible to make a profit um
especially in a service-based business
so they they run that price for
themselves they buy themselves a job and
they try and keep those prices by hiring
people and they make nothing

50
00:49:00.000 --> 00:50:00.000
so that's like mistake number one with
the pricing piece mistake number two is
that
again they don't take responsibility for
the actual mousetrap that they're
teaching these people to do which
ultimately like we don't work with i
think we people we have agency owners
who come in
and what we have on with the product of
our product
um what we push out is a rainmaker and
so that's what we call the community
rainmakers it's like everybody wants
something you can just make it rain for
them
and so that's a combination of multiple
skills that you have to put together
right like just being able to run an ad
is a skill learning how to write copy
headlines
images right and then learning how to
build landing pages and funnel processes
and then there's also like
what is the upsell process once the
person comes in the facility which is
what most agencies have no idea because
they actually have never
been in an in-person business correct
and a lot of them were like well
and third the third problem they have is
that they can't pick niches they try and
niche hop
so we have a term in our community
called a niche lab i'm gonna [ __ ]
niche slap you if you if you can't pick
one
right because you can have a hundred
million dollars just the company you
have a 100 million dollar
roofing agency 100 million dollar gym
agency it doesn't matter but you have to
pick one you can't have all three

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00:50:00.000 --> 00:51:00.000
because it's like how are you going to
compete against me in the gym space
when you also are dealing with physical
therapists and chiropractors
when i'm going this deep on serving my
clients better than you
how do you even think you deserve to get
paid more anything you deserve to get
paid we're getting paid
of course you don't and so it's making
sure that they pick
and stick with it and so there's five
stages in what we call
in in change that happen for uh for any
kind of behavioral change
and so one is uninformed optimism right
uh which is where
the grass is greener and you're like
that looks exciting so someone jumps
into a new niche and they're like this
is awesome
dentists make money i'm going to go
after dentists then they go to stage two
which is informed pessimism they now
know that this is not nearly as cool as
they thought it was
these guys have horrible front desks
they're not business acumen people their
pain and they has to make decisions
they're over analyzing cool
stage three is depression or
determination right it's the value to
spare
and so this is where like champions are
made where people fall off which is
where most people fall off
and so there's two paths from here path
number one which is what 90

52
00:51:00.000 --> 00:52:00.000
of people do is they jump back to stage
one in a different niche and they start
over again and they say
you know what it's going to be
chiropractors chiropractors are the guys
it's totally different totally different
and then they find out it's not the same
and then they go to value square and
they just continue this this rabbit hole
and the false belief they have is
i'm going to do all three and see which
one works when in reality is
you need to pick one and make it work
because all three can work but none of
them can work together
and that's the fundamental uh fallacy
that all of them come in with because
it's not like betting on horses
it's like you have a horse it's really
like having a horse that can become
you know uh i was trying to think of a
name of a champion or something i have
no idea
so a champion horse biscuits sea biscuit
yeah
yeah yeah like it's really a horse that
has the genetic potential to become a
seabiscuit
but you need to train it but all three
of them are so if you have an untrained
seabiscuit none of the three are gonna
win but if you jump on and train it all
three of them can become champion horses
but you can't train all three
and that's kind of how it is and so you
gotta give them a pick and then go super
deep on it so that they can

53
00:52:00.000 --> 00:53:00.000
reverse engineer their client businesses
and ultimately become a ring maker show
them how to sell show them how to
uh you know price their products
appropriately show them how the upsells
work
uh and show them kind of like the public
storage example i was giving you earlier
show them how to build the mouse trap
and so that's what rainmakers is for us
is
teaching all of the aggregate skills
that together make you a far more
valuable person
which is far more akin to a business
consultant that is performance driven
and so the software that we built
basically allows them
to monetize off of performance rather
than off of a fixed fee
and so with that you know in our
business we'd be able to
you know three or four x the average
amount that a client pays us every month
but that's because we're aligned with
their outcome right and so by doing that
we can have variable pay
based on the value that we provide and
so the problem is that if they switch
your performance and their lower
performance you get paid less
and so what's nice about the model is
that it makes complete transparency in
the marketplace
and ultimately i think that that's where
the marketplace always goes to a more
transparent
the more efficient you know way of
paying and so
that's the platform that we you know
created with alan and we try

54
00:53:00.000 --> 00:54:00.000
all the training around it is to
increase their skill set
so that they can provide more value and
then ultimately extract more value from
their clients and also provide it so
it's just everybody wins
yeah i had a i remember at an agency
owner who um
was doing the leads lead sheet that was
it and uh i asked i remember asking him
i was like so what's the conversion rate
how do those leads back out and you're
just like i don't know and i was like
why don't you know he's because i don't
want to ask why don't you want to ask
because i don't think it's good like
it's like i don't want to look under the
rocks
yeah yeah um it's like the ostrich in
the head in the same kind of thing
um it's it's wild all right but you have
taken
working with agency owners further than
anyone that i know in doing this
um and pushing them that far and uh but
there's a there's a software component
yeah that's badass
yeah what is that so we spent um so we
spent 4.2 million dollars building a
software over two years
you spent 2.6 on ads
it spent 4.2 on software um and so yeah
we spent a bunch of money on the
software and it was because
it was honestly just to solve this
problem that was bugging the crap out of
me which is that our gyms were not
working their leads

55
00:54:00.000 --> 00:55:00.000
and so i'll get the the 90 second story
is essentially
if i look at if i look at a gym and i
say how can i improve how much money
this gym makes
if i work with them on sales training
and drilling them and coaching all that
stuff i can get someone to double their
clothes right right and so that doubles
the throughput of marketing i mean
that's a big deal right doubling is a
big thing
but if i take one step further or one
step earlier in the funnel which is just
how many people are they actually
getting at bats with
the low performers are getting five
percent of their leads in the door and
the high performance getting 50
leads in the door so i saw a 2x
difference in throughput based on sales
closing ability
and i saw a 10x difference in throughput
based on their ability to work leads
and so i was like this one i can i can i
can provide tech you know i could put
technology around and probably
beat or at least standardize whatever
i'd rather again i'd rather have
everyone at 30 percent yeah
than have some people at five and some
people at 50. and so and again for my
business the people who are going to
cancel
are between 5 and 20 yeah who are going
to cancel with me and so
if i can just get everybody to 30 then i
know like i get rid of my high-risk
candidates
for me and so we built the software and

56
00:55:00.000 --> 00:56:00.000
it was also aligned with i know your
business which is it's all based on chat
yeah
because pick-up rates are going down uh
people don't want like
everyone gets their phone rings and is
offended by the fact that someone would
call it's like
are you okay is this an emergency then
why are you calling me right
and so it's even more so and more
exaggerated with a lead
right and so way more people responsive
via message and so we
we created um basically a bot that
learns
and so through machine learning and
human so it's both uh
basically it continues to see how humans
respond are our
humans and it logs those things and it
continues to improve on them uh
so that it can take on more and more and
more of the conversations and so like
last month we had 80 000 leads that it
worked
um and 85 of all the responses were
were from the bot not the humans and so
it is able to you know do
a lot yeah of of working leads but
there's still a human component that's
how it seems so natural is because some
of the messages that it's using are
messages that have been
cued before um and what what is it done
for show rights yeah so um we

57
00:56:00.000 --> 00:57:00.000
we're right now on average uh 50
better than the average human not the
best human we're but we're 50
better than the average human and so um
with that
that's and we do it for less so if i'm
the agency owner yeah and i was sending
the dentist 100 leads and
12 of them were showing up now and how
many show up
18. is that in that example right um
and there's four kind of pillars of lee
nurture i can go into this
as deep as you want to go uh there's
basically there's there's speed
which has two components one is the
speed between when they opt in when they
get their first message and also speed
up response in general because there's
back and forth that happen you have
these windows of opportunity where elite
is there innovation related to this is
it like the first reply is that
something
oh yeah i mean you need to be you need
to be super fast in terms of opt-in to
the first message
just to get them to reply yeah and then
also just if someone like let's say suzy
q doesn't respond to three messages and
then day two
responds you might have a five minute
window where she's sitting at karate
practice before she got there early
where you might be able to have the
opportunity to have that interaction and

58
00:57:00.000 --> 00:58:00.000
if you're not there you miss it
right so speed is those two components
then you have personalization which is
do i talk to susie different than i talk
to dan
right you would probably as a person so
we want to make sure that the machine
can do that
the third is is is is volume
volume of reach outs which is how many
reach-outs do we have typically people
call the lead once and then say the
leads the leads are bad right the leads
don't work
um and then the fourth is and there's an
optimal
cadence that i could get into about like
what time of day and all that stuff but
uh the fourth is uh one that we
discovered
uh which is availability and it's
actually the single biggest predictor on
throughput out of any of the four
variables
by a lot and so if you look at it on a
chart
it's almost a one-to-one correlation
between the total availability score
of a client versus the amount of
throughput they have compared to
hypothetical max
and so that means that if you're a
business and you're trying to grow your
business and you're only available to
take new clients between 9 and 12 on
fridays
uh you're probably not going to grow

59
00:58:00.000 --> 00:59:00.000
because it's not convenient and so we're
in an on-demand economy
and so people will just go somewhere
else they'll just go to the place that's
most convenient
layla had three places the other day
that she wanted to get our camera was
like hair or something done
and the first two had way better reviews
but the third one was available
that that moment because she was free
and so she went with the one that had
fewer reviews so better than social
proof
uh was convenience and what's
interesting is if you think about that
with like spotify and whatnot i heard
this from the ceos like do you know the
only thing that beats free
is fast so if you have
uh free food but there's a line
and food that you can pay for it's the
only thing that beats free
is speed and i thought that was kind of
interesting and so
anywho uh as an agency owner what alan
allows you to do is
you can now take over all the lead
working which means you have more
control over the results your client
and so with that our agencies can build
a mouse trap
for their clients that's going to help
them be profitable in the acquisition
they can run the ads and they work the
leads for them so really as far as a

60
00:59:00.000 --> 01:00:00.000
client is concerned they're paying for
ad spend and people just walk in their
door
it's pretty magical experience for them
and then they just get they they just
uh pay on performance which is just that
how many of these people showed
and so a big component of this was
figuring out how we could get
how we could know who showed without the
honor system right and so that took
about nine months and it continues to
improve now
um so we have a machine learning team
that looks at all the data
and creates a confidence score of based
on 140 plus data points
uh is it likely this lead is going to
show up based on all of these things
and so we bill over x percent kind of
confidence score and so like last month
we were 96.2 percent accurate based on
what they marked versus what the machine
said
it's a that just continues to improve
over time
but what it does is it takes the honor
system out of the equation and then it
allows
the agency to bill for what they
provided and allows the business owner
to not have to work their leads not have
to learn how to market and simply have
people walk in the door to close
and so if i'm an agency owner and i
don't suck yeah
uh first you would wait three and a half

61
01:00:00.000 --> 01:01:00.000
weeks because we have a waiting list um
that's genuine we really do i just
i it's you would prefer not to have it
yes yeah i prefer not to have a waiting
list but we have whales right now
um as of whatever day it is today august
first week
uh if you're listening to this later
then august first week we hopefully
don't have a waiting list
um but it's it's actually without admin
it's literally just word of mouth right
now so um
you just go to uzalan.com that's it and
then you'll see a video that's like
10 minutes long watch it and then if it
sounds like it makes sense for you
apply and then we're just taking on
application and based on the
conversation we had earlier
as long as you meet the qualifications
of an avatar that we think is going to
make sense that we can actually help
uh then we will either reach out to you
and be like hey you know we can work
with you or hey
we don't think you're at the level in
your business that will you know be able
to
uh help you with the way we want to go
because specifically because we're
performance-based business too i have no
recurring fee
and so i'm look i rather have personally
because now i can pick it i'd rather
have
you know 100 guys that i can take to 10
million
a year than have 10 000 guys
that are doing you know 10 grand a month

62
01:01:00.000 --> 01:02:00.000
right it's just you know and it's also
way more fun for me because it's more
exciting you've more interesting
conversations
yes it's not like how do i place an ad
and solving it yeah right
it's more like how do i scale from a
thousand a day to ten thousand a day an
ad spend like that's more interesting to
me
how do i find my first high level
directors how do i find operations how
do i set cadence up in the business how
do i how do i market and differentiate
myself as an authority in space like
those are the fun conversations rather
than like
how do i set up a pixel yes what is
retargeting i was really asking how do i
do it yeah
yeah um okay last question yeah um
and we're gonna totally shift you guys
here all right ten years from now
where are you what are you doing um
so ten years from now i'll probably have
exited both of these businesses
um i think either in majority or
minority so i might still be involved
with them
um i might still be majority owner and
just have you know sold a certain
percentage of it and that's mostly just
risk risk mitigation if 95 percent of my
net worth is in the equity in my company
it's like
you never know what's going to happen

63
01:02:00.000 --> 01:03:00.000
and so at a certain point i'll probably
take chips off the table
um that's kind of in terms of like big
things that would probably happen
um and then i'll probably take those
funds and start
um some sort of uh incubator
so some sort like hormozy capital or
something like that uh which would be
value add investing where i would
probably find companies that are doing
one to three maybe 10 million dollars a
year buy a meaningful stake
and then apply all of the knowledge that
we have to get them to 30 or 40 or 50
and then
and then basically flip them because
that's i i recently acquired a a piece
of a company this year and it's honestly
been great
um it's been a ton of fun um because
it's it's all the good none of the bad
because they're still a ceo and they
have their own team and it's really me
to be able to provide all my black book
of all of my contacts and providing the
strategic advice of like don't do that
already to that don't do that already
that like
stay focused do more don't do different
and just a lot just like moving them
through those the levels of you know 1
million 3 million 10 million

64
01:03:00.000 --> 01:04:00.000
you know 30 million 50 million whatever
all those levels quickly
uh without having to repeat the mistakes
and so if i can do that i can show
tremendous growth in their businesses
which will then make them more valuable
and so it's just a win-win and so that's
like where i think i can provide the
most value in the marketplace at least
with my current level of understanding
so i think that's what would happen
in 10 years or maybe less were you
living
we'll probably have multi i mean we have
uh we'll probably have multiple offices
so probably
one one lake house lake slash mountain
lake
lake slash mountain house um in uh in
colorado or utah we like both those
uh probably one beach location it might
not be a beach house but just in the
beach area
and then obviously we have our place in
texas that i we both like a lot that's
kind of like hq
because it has it's just like work home
base right but i'll probably
have uh recreated that same home base in
each of those areas
especially the mountain lake one uh
because a friend of mine
she is a tremendously successful
business and she has three houses and
she actually runs it the same way so she
has the same clothes
the same office set up the same makeup

65
01:04:00.000 --> 01:05:00.000
and all three of them
yeah and so she literally just grabs her
bag like she doesn't pack anything
and then she just hops in her net jet
and then just flies to the other place
two hours later and then she
is home like it's just that's i was like
i really like that we should do that
and so that's what we're doing that's
good that's why they're in california
and puerto rico
i have did like 20 of these shirts at
both places
yeah luke going is that i've been saying
it wrong
i've been saying it wrong yeah
[Laughter]
it's like convenient yeah awesome well
dude thank you um
for sharing all the knowledge and the
wisdom and stuff more importantly thank
you for being such a hard worker and
smart person
to have smart [ __ ] to say help so many
people who are going to get
anyone responded value out of this so
always appreciate my time with you and
uh
we'll see you guys later rock and roll
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